I’ve been monitoring some of the reactions coming out of Minnesota from the raid Tuesday on the Hartmann milk, and this one is typical:
“I am just shocked. I can’t believe this happened. If this would have happened at my milk pick-up, it would have taken everything in me to remain calm and not go to jail… for real??? My husband doesn’t even consume raw milk (he doesn’t get it) 😉 But he was still irate. I can’t believe it. He said he would have yelled ‘Sir, the only crime being committed here is your beret.’ LOL. UGH, though, seriously. This is SOOOOO scary!!!!”
Smy Opin says it well following my previous post: “I think the folks in MN need chance to absorb what has occurred. They have been preparing, but up until now, the enemy has been theoretical. So in a sense, they were blindsided by the first strike of the battle.”
To help further in absorbing what happened, I’ve posted another video below from the Hartmann customers showing the raid on Tuesday. This one clearly shows the clear police presence. It also shows Roger Hartmann explaining to a news reporter, “It’s not my product. It’s their product.” And perhaps most interesting, at the end, the Minnesota ag inspector with the beret is heard saying that it would be “too dangerous” to allow Roger Hartmann to unload his milk, apparently justifying the decision to tow his truck away.
One of the things that is curious in the Minnesota situation is how loyal customers have been to the Hartmann family and its milk. I discussed this with one customer who watched Tuesday’s events, and she told me she has been buying milk from Michael Hartmann for ten years, and raised her eleven-year-old son on it (who is very healthy as a result, she believes).
What about the people who the state of Minnesota says were sickened by the Hartmann milk, I asked her. She told me that even though she knows many of the other people who buy from him, since most are long-standing customers, she still has no idea who any of the sickened people are.
Now, you’d think that word would get around among these many people who know each other, even though the state must respect privacy laws in not releasing such information. Yet Hartmann had eager buyers on Tuesday for 400 gallons of milk, so obviously few have been scared off by the state’s announcements about illnesses–quite the contrary.
What happens next? Possibly some serious legal action. Minnesota Public Radio said in a report: “State officials say anyone selling adulterated food could face felony charges, punishable by up to ten years in prison and a $20,000 fine. They declined to say whether they intend to file criminal charges.” The report also quoted Bill Marler, the food safety lawyer, as saying filing criminal charges was “a reasonable approach.”
Gary Wood, who is executive director of the Foundation for Consumer Free Choice in Minnesota, and has been a legal advisor to the Hartmanns, says he’ll make a “formal request for a contempt citation and sanctions against the State of Minnesota.” He said the “Minnesota Constitution establishes certain basic rights including Article 13, section 7 which provides that ‘Any person may sell or peddle the products of the farm or garden occupied and cultivated by him without obtaining a license therefor.'”
It seems obvious, based on the ag agent’s assessment that the Tuesday scene was “dangerous,” Minnesota authorities won’t want a repeat of the Tuesday scenario, since they know that next time, consumers will be more outraged. So I would assume they are planning a strategy to avoid that–perhaps some kind of court injunction against any sales by Hartmann, or maybe even an arrest.
What can customers do to resist? I think Milk Farmer, Mark McAfee and Nancy Jacques have the right idea. The lawyers among us won’t say this because they can’t advise people to break the law, but I will say it. The time has come to stand up in groups, and make them arrest us with our milk, or whatever food they are trying to take from us.
The purpose would be to create the basis of a legal case. One or more consumers would need to step forward in such a situation as on Tuesday and take their milk, challenging the authorities to make an arrest. The charge in such a situation would presumably be disturbing the peace or something similar, but the consumer could argue that the state was stealing his or her food. I’ll leave the rest to the lawyers, but presumably taking possession of your food–food you’ve been receiving regularly for perhaps ten years and you’ve already paid for in a private transaction–to prevent theft would make for a pretty good argument, and something that might make sense to a jury of your peers.
I can’t think of any other options, aside from letting them continue to trample our rights and our access to our food. I have to believe it’s what our forefathers would have told us to do. ?
***
As kind of an exclamation point to the previous, S510 has now passed the U.S. House and is on its way to the Senate, where another cloture vote will determine whether it comes up. The Minnesota events may well be giving us a preview of life under the “Food Safety Modernization Act”.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/onpolitics/post/2010/12/ron-paul-federal-reserve-/1?loc=interstitialskip
Texas congressman Ron Paul, who has long wanted to get rid of the Federal Reserve, was named chairman of the House panel that oversees the central banking system.
Paul, author of End the Fed, was appointed chairman of the Domestic Monetary Policy subcommittee by Rep. Spencer Bachus, incoming chairman of the full House Financial Services Committee…………
Chris L.
If this is from the constitution, then don't all those people who had their milk illegally remove have legal recourse and can sue? After all, isn't going against the stat constitution illegal?
Maybe Hugh B has the right idea….prepare for the worst. I have 2-3 yrs to learn all I need to know about cows and pigs. sheesh!
People need to learn how to focus their anger a little more. Raise the intensity of their voices and show some growl and teeth.
Bait that Nazi. He has no balls all he has is his little para military want to be Beret
Deliver more milk and gather the crowds. Make sure you keep the cameras rolling and get every detail of the story. Make them the bad guys when then get stupid and arrest some pissed off passionate moms
Remember in this un united states of America 50000 people in CA can buy raw in 400 stores. But you people are treated like street thugs by a Nazi wearing a Beret
If that does not make your blood boil. Nothing will.
Time to organize the peoples raw milk media ambush.
It is non violent. The Beret guy brouht the violence if it happens
FYI. Cops have a very hard time arresting 50 pissed off people at a time just take your tell the Beret guy to kiss off and all walk in different directions at the same time. He will not be able to do anything. Moms are All innocent. No jury or DA will convict
The media will eat it up. Beret Nazi guy may even do something really stupid. Who knows
Mark
Those papers should have been ripped up and thrown on he ground. Those people should've taken their milk and gone to their cars and gone home. What really could those cops have done…pulled out their guns on a group of raw milk drinkers that wanted their goods. Sure.
It's hard for pro milk groups to put forth this civil disobedience tact. They have to play by the rules in order to exist. The word must go out through avenues such as this. It's time to take a stand, and let these cowards justify what they are doing.
Those folks need to have a better plan next time. Those that do raw milk drop offs need to discuss how they will act if accosted. Plans need to be made to RESIST the authorities. It's time that the legal defense fund resources are used to get people out of jail, and the abuse of power, arresting good people who just want health, is revealed for what it is.
I know I'll be talking strategy with my drop off person….
Could not agree more. Time to develop resistance strategies and turn the heat up on Beret Boy.
Keep the cameras rolling all of them. When they take your cameras there must ten of them rolling.
Stand in front of your farmer and get some guts.
Mark
Sylvia, the best place to learn about cows is: http://familycow.proboards.com/index.cgi
I would start reading now… I was a member for two years before I bought my first cow and learned a lot there. They're all very helpful and even discuss other farm animals.
To paraphrase the donkey in Shrek: I've got a gallon of raw milk and I'm not afraid to drink it.
But we're Minnesotans…We don't DO this sort of thing.
"The lawyers among us won't say this because they can't advise people to break the law, but I will say it. The time has come to stand up in groups, and make them arrest us with our milk, or whatever food they are trying to take from us. "
We need to understand that we are NOT breaking any law!The law is on our side.We need to know it and use it.All of these public officials,police included,are supposed to take an oath to protect and defend the public from robbery such as this.The "laws" that the dept of Ag is waving in front of us on those papers are not laws,they are the department's regulations that apply to people who have contracts with the department.They do not apply to people who are involved in producing their own food not under a license agreement with the department.When we understand that we are upholding the law rather than breaking it we will act with more resolve.We need to notify the police that they are violating their oath when they participate in armed robbery of people who are exercising their right to choose what they eat.
I don't get this statement? WE ALL MUST DO this sort of thing now! It is IMPERATIVE! We cannot just stand there anymore and LET them take our food! WE MUST DO THIS NEW THING!
I agree with miguel! WE are not breaking the law, it's the enforcement officers who are!
I copied the oaths from the oathkeepers.net site into a word doc with #9 detailed on the flip side. Please do this yourselves and print off several to hand to the goons.
This is not just about raw milk anymore! It's about our rights to the food we choose!
This goes back to the American Revolution – this is war NOW! WE MUST stand up and set a new precedent! WE MUST put them in their place.
http://inthemiddleofthewhirlwind.wordpress.com/you-are-what-you-eat/
"The unsettling of America, which Wendell Berry described so long ago, has actually been the order of the day for ruling elites for centuries. Whether it was the conquistadors outlawing quinoa and forcing the Inca to grow barley instead, the pioneers extirpating bison as a form of biowarfare against the Lakota, or the death squads in Colombia now liquidating peasants who stand in the way of agrofuel plantations, these policies always end up benefiting global agribusiness cartels and the current empire they sustain. "
The rest of that article is a great read, BTW. John Peck is a friend of mine, and is the executive director of a grassroots group called Family Farm Defenders.
Ken Conrad
When America was founded we as colonists repudiated all that nonsense. It seems to me that the state is now the royalty and we as a nation are now sheeple.
I am so disappointed in those whose milk was taken from them in Minnesota . . . . Why did you people not take it back if you paid for it?
Kind regards,
Violet
http://www.kilbyridgefarmmaine.blogspot.com
When my mom was in England during WWII, before D-Day, one of her friends said "Excuse me Sir" to ask directions; he was irate with her for addressing him as "sir". The WACs were just being polite. Guess class wars are never-ending.
Sheeple? I once worked in a doctors office in a large city. About 1/2 of the patients were on anti-anxiety/depressant medications. Many had jobs that required them to carry guns, many were teachers in schools. It appears that kids aren't taught to think for themselves, just to pass a test. Seems most don't question anything, and if they do, they accept blindly what is told. So yes, they are sheep following blindly to slaughter.
"the woman clearly states that E. Coli can't survive in raw milk. Thank goodness that the health department was there to lend some sanity to the situation. These people have no clue.. "
Just as those who blindly consume the adulterated foods: Fast foods/processed foods/chemically added/pesticides/herbicides, food additives/artificial colors/drugs for animals or humans are all "poisonous or deleterious substance" which may render it injurious to health; These are all unsafe. Those who consume them haven't a clue….
but i honestly don't think it's going to matter soon. the global economy is in shambles but it is such a gigantic inertwined beast that it lumbers on. shedding humans and extreme excess in it's wake. the problem it seems is simple. debt. so much debt that it can never be paid back. it is taking more money to pay the interest then is being generated by economic growth. new debt is being created to pay the interest on the old debt. then governments worldwide (actually there are parts of the world that have not reached peak debt yet but they are catching up, and meantime they are starting to wonder if all the debt they own of other governments is going to be any good in the near future.) must float even more debt to pay for running the government.
europe is doing austarity. cutting services to citizens AND raisig their taxes. this hurts economic growth… a lot. less growth means less revenue to pay the debt and therefore more debt… to pay the debt. you can start to see where this is going…
now the usa is actively printing the money. each month they print enough new money to fund our own monthly deficit of 120 billion dollars… a month. our federal government is spending 4 billion dollars a day… a day, more then it brings in.
while the federal government might get away with this for some time, the numbers are getting bigger fast. but more importantly, states and cities and counties almost without exception are playing the same debt game.
interest rates must,must, must not go up!
each tiny bit of a % that interest rates rise cost counties, cities, states and the federal government serious money. each tiny rise in interest rates force governments to add more debt to pay for it.
the economy must, must, must grow!
without a bigger pie for government to slice bigger pieces to pay interest on the bigger debt, things get out of control pretty quickly.
at 5-6% interest rates, which are (or used to be) normal most governments nationwide and worldwide will be spending most of their income on interest payments.
we live in a debt based world. new debt is constantly needed to create growth. growth has always been there except when it wasn't. but it always came back. usually quite quickly. economies ran on the principle of out with the old and in with the new.
but now we keep the old and shift their crushing debt onto the tax payer. this way none of the elite lose any money.
but it also damages the economy. the fraud is astounding yet no perp walks. people see this, even if only on an uncouncious level. it effects their faith and willingness to follow every gosh darn stupid little law imposed on them. heck the big guys don't need to follow them…. why should i? people do this without actively thinking about it.
in the usa and much or europe little of our economic activity is real production. we're a "service" economy. a term that is almost 20 years old. we've shipped most of our good middle class manufacturing jobs to china, mexico and anywhere wages are cheaper then in america.
our economy needs to grow to improve. it has to grow with $3 a gallon gas maybe $4 soon. it has to grow with less jobs available. it has to grow with the remaining jobs being mostly lower paying then we;ve had in the past. it has to grow with cronic 10% official unemployment that if measured the same way it was in 1930 would chalk up at 23%.
our economy has to grow with housing still 20-30% over valued and 25% of homeowners with a mortgage owing more for their house then they can sell it for. it has to grow with commercial real estate down 40% so far and headed for more down side. it has to grow more even after the housing boom tricked home depot and lowes and walmart and everybody else into expanding and opening 1000's and 1000's of new stores over the last decade.
it has to grow even though people have been on a debt fueled spending spree for the last 10 years and more, and are tapped out and worried for their job and paying too much interest on too much debt already.
oh, and it can't just sputter along at 1-2% growth. noooooooo… it needs a strong 4-5% growth and it needs it now!
oh, i almost forgot, food is rising in price, gas is rising in price, taxes and fees are rising all over the place as governments try and fill the gaping holes in their budgets. and our federal government "compromises" by adding 900 billion more dollars to our federal debt over the next two years.
how will it end? are you doing anything to increase your chances of making it thru this storm (which has barely begun) intact?
in time should some government goon try and take your milk from you they will be lucky to get away with their life. we will need all of you farmers desperately in the coming years, food bill or no food bill. if there even is still a functioning government there will be no goons to harass people over milk, or much of anything else there will also be very little in the grocery store for a good while at some point of this collapse.
hardening your life/family/home a bit will only do you good no matter what happens.
government will go insane (it they are't already) as they struggle to survive. i take soliice in the knowledge that never before in history has the old government survie such an economic/currency collapse. what's unkown is what kind of goverrnment takes it's place. hitler was elected by the german middleclass after their economy wentoff a cliff much like the one we're speeding toward.
Yes there might be 'incidences'…and some people might get sick…but this is what is going on now with many other foods, even with the regulations that are in place.
Small local producers limit the extent of a possible outbreak…large commercial producers encourage large widespread outbreaks…when there is a problem.
The FDA, as does Lykke, have it ass backwards…although you got to admire her passion and spunk…it's just misdirected.
The marketplace is always consumer controlled…and when government, via regulation, tries to effect that market, it makes it more difficult for the natural consumer driven forces to govern.
That someone gets sick is terrible…but the notion that any food supply can be perfect is not a reality…unless of course, everything that is consumed is sterilized.