The term “fascist” is often used as a pejorative, to brand those who oppose seemingly progressive agendas as extremists.
But it’s actually a particular political system, characterized by three components: dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and control of industry and commerce, all in the name of new-found nationalism.
There has been a huge amount of debate in both the mainstream and social media about the first two components, but much less attention to the third one. So I’d like to focus mostly on that last item, the control of industry and commerce, because that is where we are beginning to see real-life decisions from the current administration—most specifically in the area of agriculture—and it has all the makings of a fascist approach. From the newspaper headlines, it seems as if the new administration is confused and falling all over itself in terms of policy. But behind the headlines, important decisions are being taken and policies implemented. If you examine three important areas of agriculture, you see serious signs of intrusive government control, to favor large corporations.
1. New moves to restrict raw milk. Now, I know raw milk is a tiny part of the $27 billion dairy industry, but it’s long been viewed as a potential threat by Big Dairy because it’s been one of the only types of fluid milk showing significant expansion over the last decade (along with organic milk; more about organics in the next section). Big Dairy doesn’t like to see small dairy farms discover economically viable products, because this symbolizes competition. Raw-dairy rejuvenation has occurred in line with a pullback by both states and federal authorities beginning a little over ten years ago, when the state of Michigan, the first state in the country to ban raw milk in the late 1940s, reversed course after its 2006 raid on Michigan farmer Richard Hebron, and moved to allow herdshares. That was followed by similar relaxations of enforcement in Ohio, California, Pennsylvania, Colorado, Massachusetts, Missouri, Minnesota, and even “the dairy state” of Wisconsin (following the court victory by farmer Vernon Hershberger).
Over the last year, though, we’ve seen a reversal of the decade-long expansion of raw milk availability. The U.S. Food and Drug Administration seems to have been given a green light to aggressively go after raw milk once again, and it has moved most notably to clamp down on soaring sales of raw camel milk, by taking legal action against a Missouri dairy that supplied the bulk of raw camel milk around the country via the distributor, Desert Farms. Now, if you go to the Desert Farms web site, all you’ll find among the fresh camel milk options is “pasteurized” or “lightly pasteurized.”
We know as well that New Jersey regulators have gone after raw milk consumers in that state with threats of legal action, most likely with the encouragement of the FDA. In Virginia, which allows herdshares, legislation has been introduced requiring farmers who run them to notify state health authorities if any herdshare owners possibly become ill from their milk, and to allow state authorities access to their farms without a search warrant. Violations are punishable as Class 1 misdemeanors, which allows up to a year in jail and a $2,500 fine. According to the Virginia Consumers and Farmers Association, this proposed legislation comprises “the first steps in destroying the very farm operations that allow people to access cream line raw milk ( farm fresh, unpasteurized, unhomogenized).” Once again, you have to think the FDA had a hand in this, as it often does with raw dairy at the state level.
—New moves to undermine organic standards and food sovereignty initiatives. Big Ag hates organic food because it’s become a huge source of competition over the past 30 years, growing to something well in excess of $40 billion annually in the U.S., according to various estimates. Just last month, the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) said it was abandoning one of the major organic initiatives of the last decade— the Organic Livestock and Poultry Practices rule. This established humane treatment standards for chickens, pigs, and cows raised organically. According to the Humane Society of the U.S., “The USDA finalized the rule in January 2017, after a decade of input from thousands of organic producers and consumers, and in doing so, it put the nation on a path to have rigorous and comprehensive standards for cows, pigs, chickens, and other farm animals raised under the organic seal.”
The USDA threw it all out, just like that, as an apparent sop to Big Ag. The Organic Trade Association is suing to have the rule implemented.
The USDA has also gone after Maine’s first-in-the-nation Food Sovereignty Act, threatening to withdraw approval of that state’s slaughterhouses unless the law was changed, which would have shuttered five slaughterhouses. The Maine legislature eventually watered the law down, requiring towns and cities that adopt new ordinances to “comply with state and federal laws” for meat and poultry sales.
—New moves to undermine marijuana. Finally, just as marijuana has become legalized to at least some degree in more than half the states, and spawned a new agricultural opportunity for farmers and other entrepreneurs, the federal government has threatened to pull the rug out on the whole trend. Why? Apparently pot is a threat to the alcohol industry, not to mention to Big Pharma, as more health benefits are associated with it.
The new orders and threats against various segments of agriculture have been billed mostly as “deregulation.” But when you come down to it, all these actions are designed to destabilize one area of business for the benefit of another. You water down organic standards to encourage producers of non-organic food. You threaten producers of marijuana in states where it is legal, in order to reduce investment in that business segment.
In just the last few days, we’ve seen tariffs imposed on imported solar panels, following on deregulation associated with coal production. Once again, the goal is to penalize one segment of the economy (a non-polluting energy source) in favor of a domestic polluting one.
The tax cut, as well, is designed to provide a huge financial windfall to big business—on the order of $1.5 trillion, according to the estimates tossed around when it was being debated in Congress in December. You can be sure that the next step will be to go after entitlements like Social Security and Medicare, with the argument that the deficit has become so large that programs benefiting ordinary people can no longer be afforded and must be slashed.
I know some here will argue that favoritism of big business has been ongoing for many years. But the reality is that in dairy, organic standards, and marijuana, at least, the trend had shifted in important respects over the last decade. Now it is shifting again, and not in favor of small farms and their supporters.
Framing Food Policy: The Case of Raw Milk
Authors
Wendy M. Rahn,
Sarah E. Gollust,
Xuyang Tang
First published: 31 March 2016Full publication history
Abstract
Policies governing the sale of raw milk—making the sales of raw milk more permissive—are gaining traction on the legislative agendas of dozens of states. This paper examines one contributor to this movement on the policy agenda: the role of competitive framing. By combining theoretical approaches from policy studies and political psychology theories of competitive framing, we offer evidence supporting the recent relative success of raw milk activists in several state legislatures. Using an Internet survey-based experiment with a sample size of 1,630 respondents from seven Midwestern states, we show that a frame emphasizing consumer choice and food freedom is more effective than the frame that dominates among the policy establishment, that emphasizing public health risks. This is true in both one-sided and competitive framing contexts. We further show that those previously aware of this issue were less influenced by the public health frame than those naïve to the issue. Our results suggest that the pro-raw milk movement may be making strides on the state policy agenda because their frames are more resonant among the public. We also highlight the advantages gained from considering psychological and policy processes simultaneously to understand policy change.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/psj.12161/abstract
Joseph, part of my point is that, for whatever success raw milk and food rights activists have had, they’d better be on their toes, per the USDA initiative in Maine and the local/FDA initiative in Virginia and offensive against camel milk by the FDA that I describe, for new efforts to rescind the gains that have been experienced…..all as part of the new fascist agenda.
I have felt for a while we are heading towards fascism. One thing I have noticed, if you ask the average American “What is the difference between communism,fascism,socialism, etc.?” I”ll be most would be shocked to find most cannot tell you the difference in philososphies of those isms!!
I’ll BET most would, not be LOL!! keyboard issues,I need a bigger one for my fingers.
A year or more ago, I saw comments from a WAP board director that said something like: Trump is going to change raw milk laws….he drinks raw milk! ( he drinks 12 diet cokes a day )
There were rumblings from conservatives that Trump would wash away excessive Federal Laws ( CFR 1240.61 ) and allow raw milk to flow over stare lines! Yah….he washed away enforcement of the USDA NOP pasture rule instead!!! For his mega CAFO friends.
If you want to hear Trump make a promise you like…..just listen long enough, because his promises change like diapers on a newborn. In hours or days his promises change 180 degrees. He lied to everyone and the naive got taken.
The bottom line is this. Trump is a pathological liar. His true colors are deep green. The color of money and not green pastures. At the USDA Sonny Perdue has said that the NOP is “overly prescriptive” when it comes to the 120 day pasture rule and 30% Dry Matter Intake. He stated that it is unfair for larger operators and makes it tough to comply with organic rules.
Shock….total mind blowing disgust….of course the NOP is prescriptive about the mandatory 120 day pasture rule for organic dairies!!!! With out the rules, there would be no organic standards and organics are dead and done!
Sonny Perdue is ruining organics.
With the huge CAFO organic dairy in Colorado and three more in Texas milking 14,000 cows each and no pasture rule enforcement, CA organic dairies are literally dying. Those 4 dairies are equal to 1500 Wisconsin sized organic dairies or 100-200 CA sized organic dairies. There are about 150 organic dairies in CA total.
Fascism is a word that fits this well. Unfair application of rules by the governemnt to meet the needs of the rich and few.
Our CA Pasture Rule Protection Act in CA has gained huge support….it has also picked a fight with the huge CAFO dairies. But, when they object, they will be publically self indicting themselves. Objection publically exposes them as the cheaters!
It will be a fight between smaller verses bigger. And the expectations of the consumer verses the scam.
A worthy blood bathe and very revealing. The battle will start very soon if it already has not started. I am bracing for the first rounds over the bow.
It is a battle for the heart of organics, cows on green grass, integrity, fairness, nutrition, carbon sequestration, good fats, organic market economics family farms, and so much more.
I am so damn glad I am a raw dairy with consumers that love us. We are not really part of this battle but we have joined to help our fellow organic dairymen and women. Raw is a world beyond organics.
Take a stand against organic CAFO rape or lie down be quiet and get raped…it is time to get loud and fight.
It is “ME Too” Time for honest organic dairies. For any organic dairies out there in blog land, submit a complaint at the USDA website. Be part of the solution. Being silent is complicity in this CAFO organic market rape. Watching your organic pay prices drop by 40% in 18 months ? There is something you can do today. Act!!! Or die off.
Mark
Mark,
The raw milk and organics movements are not just at odds against the ongoing anti free choice, industry driven politics of Washington, but also against consumers such as William March who believe that government food regulations are just tickety boo… a.k.a doing a wonderful job at providing safe and healthy food for the consumer…
A fine product of the revolving door employment policy that has been in place for years now at all the ABC government agencies.
We are going the way of the Roman Empire and the Soviet Union, LOL!!
Yes, “favoritism of big business has been ongoing for many years”. Obama and his dark act was a continuum of that fact and I don’t expect a whole lot different from Trump. That being said here is a dfferent perspective you might find interesting.
“Trump gives rural America its due while Canada’s politicians put farmers in poor house”
https://www.therebel.media/trump_gives_rural_america_its_due_while_canada_s_politicians_put_farmers_in_poor_house
Ken,
Do You believe what Farm Bureau( an insurance company that lobbies for large ag corporations and fight against the smaller farmer) spews?
Also Ken,
American farmers are NOT having as great as that article suggests LOL!!
YES FARM BUREAU ONLY INTERESTED IN SELLING INSURANCE , WE FOUND THAT OUT PERSONALLY .
Was part of grass roots contingent to pass RAW MILK BILL, here in ARKANSAS a few years ago and we won !! Thanks to many dedicated determined Independents .
Farm bureau was heading the fight along with large Dairy corps. against Farmers to sell Raw Milk from farms only .
When i pushed our local State Senator and Reps. they were on the fence till we gathered steam and had many Voters behind FOOD CHOICE /Freedom CHOICE – Raw Milk .
RAW GOAT MILK AND CHEESE IS POPULAR HERE IN ARKANSAS ALREADY TO WAS PROBABLY AN EASIER STEP THAN OTHER STATES . WE ALL NEED TO PUSH FEDERAL SENATORS AND REPS. ON THESE FREEDOM ISSUES, NOW ,,,MAKE THE CALLS TELL THE PERSON WHO ANSWERS THE PHONE (POLITELY NOW ) , WHAT YOU WANT in a SHORT BRIEF STATEMENT , i ALWAYS SAY I KNOW HUNDREDS OR THOUSANDS OF INTERESTED PARTIES IN GROUPS AND FRIENDS THAT WE PARTICIPATE IN FOR THERE SUPPORT .
Obama tried early in his first term to deliver on a promise he made to break up Big Ag concentration in meat. He was met with so much resistance from Big Ag, which got its legislators to fight Obama, that he had to pull back, per this analysis in 2011:
“Believe it or not, the USDA’s Vilsack and Butler came through last year with strong new proposed rules to protect smaller producers that would have changed all that. The draft rule garnered support from many quarters — including the typically Big Ag-friendly American Farm Bureau — and prompted the moderate ag lobbying group the National Farmers Union to refer to it approvingly as ‘the Ranchers Bill of Rights.'”
http://grist.org/factory-farms/2011-11-09-killing-the-competition-meat-industry-reform-takes-a-blow/
Of course, Michelle Obama often made known her commitment to local food and healthy diet for children.
I’d be curious if you know of a single expression of support from Trump for any segment favoring smaller farms or local food. Only thing I’m aware of is that very early in his campaign, Trump made a reference to putting a lid on “the food police at FDA.” But a policy statement to that effect disappeared from his web site within a few hours or days of that, never to be seen again. As Mark McAfee notes, a number of his supporters were speculating that he was a secret raw milk drinker, which turned out to be nonsense for a guy who prefers fast food and Diet Coke. I’m not aware of a single indication of support for good food, or to put a lid on Big Ag.
i believe that the organic attacks are more directed at watering the crappy USDA standards further so that the industry can both claim the higher priced income from “organic” products while cutting cost corners and killing the planet at the same time.
The USDA ORGANIC standards have ALWAYS had the fatal flaw of being a “guaranteed process” versus a certification of product like some of the older organic standards had been. If the product was sampled and poisonous – it couldn’t have been sold as organic in the better years.
Now – you are virtually guaranteed genetic contamination from GMOs and their GMOron farming since all susceptible genetics WILL get contaminated. If product quality were monitored this couldn’t have happened – or at least not so easily. By pretending a safe process is safety, they made sure the GMO contamination could happen (and someday testing will show that there is no safe foods in the GMO lines – and then they can steal all the farmer’s profits) while they made things sound pretty for the public.
Friends,
You guys are sounding like you passively accept this organic dilution and fascist oppression. Not my style, it is time to do something about it. Cows on grass and a market that pays a fair price is important. If the Pasture Rule is desemated or ignorred…. organics will be CAFO. CAFO organic will drive over the grass pasture rule like a Cat D-11 Tracklayer.
Simple as that. Silence is complicity defined.
Really big of you guys to blame the new sitting President for the actions of Fdup and Usdup. If you think that he has much control there you might ask congress and senate if they do as well. The politics gets really deep when you look for a scapegoat for the deficiencies of the these bureaucracies and can’t tell that industry along with Deep State are pushing their agenda where for eight years they had a puppet to manipulate. Please move your incoming date search into the private zone where the media does not continue to manufacture nonsense, and see how many of your heroes will be in prison before natural health gains back some position. Simply look beyond the bullsh*t.. Good Day!
Thanks for speaking truth, Alvin. We always appreciate your comments here in Wisconsin!
Your hatred of Trump is clouding your judgement. We’ve been a fascist state for a hundred years. These things you report are not new approaches on food issues, but a continuation of previous trends by the feds.
The one seeming exception to that is the Organic Livestock and Poultry Practices rule. But even that is not as you say. It may have been worked on for a long time but the details when it published were not as expected and there was significant opposition in and out of Congress; even amoung small family farmers.
I’m not surprised it got reversed. It was an easy bargaining chip given the opposition. And doing so was consistent with Trump’s promise to reduce regulation and not increase costs of business via regulation. And unlike the previous Presidents, this one has actually been keeping promises.
“tariffs imposed on imported solar panels, following on deregulation associated with coal production”
What do you have against making solar panel’s in America? Do you want American jobs lost to cheap Chinese production?
The major early move on coal regulation was to halt a not yet effective regulation that was going to cost jobs. This is in direct opposition to Hilary’s promise to eliminate coal jobs.
Its things like that which won Trump the election. He valued American jobs more than empty virtue signaling.
A fascist state for 100 years? I guarantee you, when we actually become a fascist state, you will know it. We’ll stop having elections, or the ones we have will be pre-ordained with the dictator in charge guaranteed to win. During WWII, we fought an alliance of fascist states–Japan, Germany, Italy, with Spain hanging on the periphery. Today’s prominent fascist states are Russia, Turkey, Philippines, Egypt–run by a dictator who rules with an iron fist and rewards his friends in big business. We may well be on our way, as this analysis suggests:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/27/us/politics/congress-dysfunction-conspiracies-trump.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
As far as solar business is concerned, we long ago lost the manufacturing part of that business to the Chinese and others in Asia. No way we’re getting that back. But lots of jobs are at stake in U.S. for installation of solar panels. By making imported solar panels more expensive, Trump putting the installation business at risk, because solar could become less competitive with carbon energy sources. Here is one perspective:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/opinion/solar-power-trump-administration.html?action=click&module=Associated&pgtype=Article®ion=Footer&contentCollection=Paul%20Krugman
one of the many signals – there in plain view, on either side of the chair of the House of Representatives – that the US of A demonstrably IS a fascist state, is the bundle of rods bound with ligatures, especially the ax at its top … the very symbol of ancient Rome. Just a co-incidence? Tupper Saussy’s masterpiece ” Rulers of Evil” explains.
the image at the URL link, below, speaks volumes
https://www.google.ca/search?q=image+bundle+of+fasces+House+of+Representatives+US+of+America&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=fDGM1v0wiEKElM%253A%252Ca8Ds4nK5NM3AVM%252C_&usg=__AaWkfaBKpvPqReoNPyXu9fvjaN0%3D&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiHv_Gm6PnYAhUO9GMKHbZaDgQQ9QEIQzAF#imgrc=Qw4CtOrZlWE_AM:
David, maybe you haven’t noticed, but we HAVE stopped having elections, in any real sense. And it’s not Russia we have to blame for this, but our own corrupt 2-party system. If it wasn’t for their machinations, Bernie Sanders would be president today. How about getting off your naive political soap box and sticking to the one issue we read your page for – raw milk.
If we’ve stopped having elections in any real sense, why are the ones we have so hotly contested? I’m not just talking about the presidential election, but the many hundreds of elections we have for the federal legislature as well as state legislatures and governorships. I’ll say it again: you would definitely notice if we just let the current strongman assume absolute power. Likely, before long you’d have a situation like Russia or Venezuela or Turkey where political dissenters are murdered or imprisoned, and blogs like this are banned. And no, Bernie Sanders wouldn’t be president, because he didn’t win as many primary voters as Hillary Clinton did.
Finally, this blog isn’t just about raw milk. But if you bothered to read my current post, you’ll see that about half of it concerns raw milk.
weston price foundation is at the forefront to challenge money hungry bstds!!….All citizens be alert…the occupants greed has no boundary!!…ALL of his appointments are greed mongers….plain and simple!!!
AGREED ! WESTON PRICE ASSISTED WITH OUR SHARED INFO ON RAW MILK BILL PASSED HERE IN ARKANSAS , THANK YOU WESTON PRICE ORG. !!
I must have got it all wrong. Trump loves local food….as long as KFC is close by and he has a diet coke in his hand… with 10 more readily available…..food is local.
My deepest apologies to my conservative friends and especially Gordon.
Mark, your constant derogatory remarks about the president, say a lot more about you than they do about him. Why don’t you instead tell us how much better things would be if Hillary was now in charge at the oval office. Remember, she has been in the oval office before (as part of Bill Clinton’s clan and private and confidential advisors, we’ll never know) and look at how that worked out for the average American common man and the economy in general.
never lost for a contribution on this forum, as long as he can desparage PRESIDENT Trump, somehow – vis. = the consumate ad hominem remark in a venue devoted to good food… the horror! the horror!! … Donald Trump actually enjoys a couple of the staples of the mainstream American diet. But of course = Mr McAffee’s lips have never been sullied by such
I’m left guessing that by his prediction last fall : “Pence by Xmass”, Mr McAffee meant : Xmass 2027.
I would rather think about how much better things would be if Jill Stein( or Bernie) was our president, instead of a rich man that has a very high opinion of himself and looks down on “regular” people with great disdain and whose ego is so inflated as to think he is almost god-like. I thought that when he got elected he may be able to shake things up a bit, but certainly not in the manner he has. His behavior is very adolescent and extremely unpresidential. I REALLY wish it weren’t so. To all you haters, “whatever!”
Gordon,
You are VERY comedic!!
The word Fascist and Raciest are now being thrown around in this country since Donald Trump was elected president ,of which he is neither .Now the word Faciest is being used to describe remarks and persons,not agreeing with different opinions and actions .Examples of this are as follows,Desert Farms camel milk which was being sold across the USA as raw milk .Desert farms is a company from California owened by Walid Abdul Wahab he purchased the milk from Amish farmers in Missouri and than sold it other states .The reason the USDA got involved was that the milk was adverised as having medicinal value such as possiblly curing autisim ,parasites periodontal diease ,crohns cancer,wound healing and TB ,of which it cured NONE ,and so the USDA got involved .Camels milk is very expensive over $200 a gallon so persons purchase this milk hoping to find cures and relief from their illness after reading false material . As far as New Jersey is concerned a person got sick from drinking raw milk from a certain dairy and the state found the sorurce so
naturally they cracked down since raw milk is still illegal in that state .Virginia is the same situation they want to require raw milk farmers to notify the state is someone gets A ill ,is that wrong ?.As far as search warrants to inspect a farm I believe all states require inspections of farms selling any milk to the public without a warrant.Lastly as far as farmers getting into the marijuana business I am sure they can find other crops besides marijuana to grow .The politicians will control the cash windfall coming out of the growing and distribution of both medicinal and legal sales ,wait to see the relatives ,inlaws and cousins of politicians that get these lucrative contracts.
Lets stop trowing words like FASCIST around it has a very strong meaning .Thank You .
For the record, it was FDA that went after Desert Farms, not USDA. I don’t know what was claimed on its web site, but there have been several studies indicating raw camel milk helps moderate severe behaviors of autism. The milk is pricy because camels give much smaller amounts than cows.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26577969
NJ residents hit with cease and desist not consuming milk from possibly offending dairy. Illness you speak of appears to be from vaccine, per state of PA statement (which I wrote about). As for VA situation, the dairies being targeted aren’t selling to the public, but rather to herdshare owners (even defined in the legislation). These are private sales.
The point is that the tide appears to have shifted on raw dairy. No state that I know of ever attempted the kind of law being proposed in VA, to go after dairies privately serving cowshares with misdemeanor charges and possible jail time. And no, regulators can’t go onto a private farm and poke around without a search warrant. But, then, you seem to be a defender of government regulators, no matter what. Dangerous territory, not a stretch when taken in combination with other trends I pointed out to label it a component of fascism.
Thank You David,
My first thought, the FDA controls milk, not USDA.
Here in Michigan, the citizens stood up, we got legal cow shares.
Hi david
yes there was a study by dr. hinkle out of the south.she was trying to see if it helped autistic children and diabetes patients
she helped a farmer acquire a herd of camels to further the movement .I met her right after she did this study
amazing results she found and its very helpful with diabetes
yeah pricy and a camel costs about 20 grand
Fascist stays in vocabulary for keeps….thank you, David….don’t let these voices have any effect on your good soul.
The one thing I don’t like about the Internet: Talk is so cheap and getting cheaper.
Where is the world where action and deeds are valued and appreciated and talk is backed up by deeds and action.
Sick of blah….blah ….blah. Talk talk talk. Where is the content and real action? Perhaps people are taking their example from their president. Lies are are expected, idiocy is normal, blind stupidity is not news! We are numbed down to raw nerves.
All the while we have done nothing about Russian intrusion into our elections, we have degraded our FBI and CIA and another election is seven months away. Those that protect and swoon over Trump are complicit in the bloodless Russian Red Dawn. Trump has assisted Russian attacks on the USA by weakening our defenses ignoring the election breaches and calling it fake news.
I am continually perplexed at how it is that true religious conservatives can love an immoral, Porn Star screwing and unfaithful, Russian loving, twittering, out if control idiot. I just don’t get it. It is time to place ethics and country over blind immoral partisan politics at all cost.
The cost of our beloved country.
Dear friends….it is time to awaken from your stupor and sober up. It is time to be clear minded adult citizen patriots.
your input on this forum to do with REAL MILK is greatly appreciated, Mark McAffee. But keep to yourself theongoing symptoms of Trump Derangement Syndrome. I go back so far I recall how Ann Landers would end a column in which she’d let a correspondent unburden herself, whyning about some petty self-centred complaint : “you ought to seek professional help”
I do agree with you that “it is time to awaken from YOUR stupor, and sober up” = start with accepting as reality the fact Donald Trump is now PRESIDENT whilst your candidate and the Clinton Crime Family faces indictment for Treason and other high crimes. Russian interference with the election”? Oh, you mean like your pal Hilary accepting a bribe of unspeakable amounts of $$s, for giving away control of America’s uranium resource?! Regardless of his warts / failings, Trump will do one thing right : Bill and Hilary are on their way to prison.
“Patriots” ?!! oh, that’s rich! coming from a guy who condones masked thugs, intimidating political speech and rioting … that’d be your friends, ANTIfa… who use the very same flag they did in the 3rd Reich.
Fascism is defined as “an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization”. I tend to agree with those who believe that fascism can be an attribute of both “right wing” and “left wing” ideologies. Mussolini himself described fascism as a movement that would strike “against the backwardness of the right and the destructiveness of the left”. In other words, a liberal supposedly moderate ideology if you will that combines the attributes of both right and left. As is supposed to be the case in Canada with the Liberal party; a party in my opinion that tends to lean more often then not to the left and is sometimes almost indistinguishable from the left wing, socialist NDP party…
Both Mussolini and Hitler shared the belief that the future of their movements depended on molding young people by indoctrinating them in body, mind and spirit; Is this not an accurate description of an ongoing occurrence via the education system, the media and the film industry at large in the United States and Canada today?
Mussolini also declared, “The keystone of the Fascist doctrine is its conception of the State, of its essence, its functions, and its aims. For Fascism the State is absolute, individuals and groups relative”. Gee, this sounds much like the top-down governing approach that many countries in the world including the US and Canada are using today! Trump appears to be balking the above trend… a historical establishment, almost “religious” quasi-fascist trend of both the left and the right. Indeed, as Mussolini again stated, “Fascism is a religion. The twentieth century will be known in history as the century of Fascism”. Little did he know that it
s tentacles would stretch well beyond the twentieth century…
Mussolini also said: Fascism should actually be called corporatism, for it IS the merger of corporate and government powers. Sound familiar to anyone??
BUt, of course, Mussolini got what was coming to him. Suppose if politics worked like that here today, our politicians would most likely be much more honest!! LOL!!
Based on my limited understanding of the Fascist, phenomenon, it would appear that the establishment in the United States/North America and Europe, despite it’s left or right political leanings, have been advocating those fascist principles I mentioned above for decades. Donald Trump despite his faults and buffoonery is not, or at least I don’t think he is, or not yet that is, a member of the establishment. If anything he is a thorn in the establishment’s side, and an unpredictable wild card. It is common knowledge that the establishment likes predictable politicians!!! Indeed and this is why Donald Trump is now your President. What Trump is able to accomplish in light of the highly powerful corporate biased institution’s In Washington remains to be seen!
The following article entitled, As a school teacher, I taught that Fascism was characterized by four tendencies: extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-communism, and state-sponsored capitalism. Through notions of American exceptionalism, “Tea-partyism,” the continued phobia towards Socialism/Communism, the various complexes and networks that work against democracy and governmental transparency, the Patriot Act, and the growth of the U.S. corporate state, America has embrace all of the basic elements of Fascism… You can call it corporatism, neo-fascism or fascism, but in the end it is what it is!”
http://www.sebadamani.com/blog/corporatocracy-is-it-a-synonym-for-fascism
Indeed, and it has been around for a long time… long before you and I and Donald Trump.
Correction… The following article entitled,“Corporatocracy: Is it a Synonym for Fascism” states,”As a Teacher…
The term fascist in today’s world is primarily used in a derisive sense in order to express contempt or ridicule of an individual or political system even though most people including myself have a difficult time grasping its true meaning.
With respect to your above referenced Mussolini quote, Wikipedia has this to say, “This quote: ‘Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power.’ Does not appear in Enciclopedia Italiana 1932, although often cited to this source. It is very likely not an accurate quote. If anyone can find a source, please post the cite here. The quote has been debated and removed from the Wikipedia pages”.
There are numerous other websites that say likewise or suggest a different translation of the term that Mussolini used; namely, his use of the word “corporazione, the Italian name for what was known in Germanic Europe as a Medieval guild”.
Ken,
I stand corrected :>) I have seen this statement attributed to Mussolini in quite a few places, Wikiquote did say that he may have said it elsewhere, but who knows!!
But here is a definition: “Fascism – A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism.” – American Heritage Dictionary, 1983
I don’t recall Gumpert having a conniption fit when Obama started assassinating American citizens. Nor did he attribute everything bad the FDA/USDA did to Obama himself.
This isn’t about truth or political theory, this is about politics and Trump not being ostensibly from his side. The left likes to call anything to their right fascist. It is no more accurate than any other slur they use.
Pete, don’t think I mentioned Trump in that post. In any event, my intention was to point out the trends. In the prior administration, there had been some relaxation of raw milk regulation, encouragement of local food. Per the trends I ID’d in the post, looks like a reversal of those trends so as to benefit big business. When government economic focus is heavily on pleasing big business, you are heading into fascist territory. Did I miss something in the ag area you are aware of that counters my argument?
You conveniently forget things like FSMA. You call it pleasing big business, others call it eliminating job killing regulations. It’s a question of perspective. The lefty always freaks out about fascism when things swing back to the right.
The regulatory state is the totalitarian state. It is this administration that has rolled back incredible amounts of government regulation.
I didn’t forget about FSMA. Bad news, though the reality is that it was never fully implemented. But again, I’m curious about specifics. Any regulations affecting small farms that have been eliminated or reduced? I wrote about citizen petition to FDA to get rid of reg outlawing interstate shipment of raw milk. That petition seems to have disappeared into a black hole. Main regs I see eliminated are those that put a lid on pollution, worker safety.
Ken, I absolutely agree with you that both left and right wing ideologies can be fascist. Look at Russia. The old Soviet Union was ostensibly communist. Today, Russia, the largest component of the Soviet Union, is best described as a fascist state–completely authoritarian, with most business conducted by state-supported oligarchs. Venezuela’s current government started as a socialist under Cesar Chavez, and has since morphed into what can only be considered a fascist state under his successor, Nicolas Maduro, which is in the process of starving its people rather than allow any kind of democratic processes.
I’d caution you about labeling the U.S. and Canada as fascist in their current makeup. Try spending some time in Russia or Venezuela (or Turkey or Philippines as well) and then make that statement. And I’d disagree with you about Trump. Just look at how he is going about undermining key institutions charged with maintaining the rule of law, like the FBI and the Justice Department, carrying out purges. All designed to lead to one-party dictatorial rule. Fewer and fewer obstacles in his way, though the end result still up in the air.
I am not always quoted correctly in this Rutgers student news paper but here goes:
http://www.dailytargum.com/article/2018/01/rutgers-professors-weigh-in-on-raw-milk-movement
Dr. Heckman,
A nicely written article, Thank You!! Too bad your colleague takes the pasteurization stance as being more safe. Maybe he has not seen the statistics on deaths and illnesses from pasteurized dairy products?? I’m sure he has. Thank You again and to Mark Mcafee also!!
Mark, you wrote an excellent comment above and just ruined it with an immature and silly mainstream media-generated characterization of President Trump. It is extremely unfortunate here that this crucial issue is being clouded by knee-jerk hatred of Trump. If we can’t step back and see the big picture that food freedom has been under attack, yes, for the last century, we can’t come together and fight for it. Personally, I wish Bernie Sanders or Jill Stein was president, but it would not change the fact that Big Ag, and indeed the Deep State, corporatocracy, or whatever you chose to call it, dominates our government no matter who is in charge. THEY are the enemy, not the figurehead that they control. I agree with Gordon Watson – let’s stop the cheap shots on our duly-elected president and focus on the real criminals here.
Mark Donald Trump never degraded the FBI or the CIA he questiond the leadership at the top and I agree . There seems to be some partisan bias againt the legally elected current President by some of the leaders at the top of the FBI.The agents of FBI are wonderful dedicated Americans that do not let their political beliefs get in the way of investigations .My brother was a highly decorated FBI agent for over 30 years and before he passed away of cancer last year he backed President Trump .At my brothers funeral last March I spoke to several agents and they did not like what was going on at the top of the FBI some told me they wanted to leave the job .I also know a retired CIA agent and he has the same opinion of FBI leadership .
As far as Donald Trumps sexual escapades they seem to have been in the past and should not be in the news since he was a private citizen .I seem to remember a certain President that while in the White House he liked to put things and cigars in places they did not belong and we were told by the press it was none of our business since it was a personal matter .I would suggest you keep promoting your good raw milk and stay out of the crazy politics on this blog .Thank You
@ William March:
Once again, I totally agree with your above post. I have a niece who is currently with the FBI, although in a different capacity than what’s been in the news recently, but she hates it. She doesn’t care for any of what’s going on because it is going to change the landscape of what was once a powerful and respected organization.
I also agree with your assessment of President Trump vs. Clinton. People need to start supporting and stop talking against him because we need unity not diversion. Our enemies love all the condescending crap in the media, etc.
Do those people who write trash about him think no one else reads what they write? It’s pure ignorance to degrade the leader of our country, no matter who it is. It’s mostly just plain, unsubstantiated gossip anyhow. https://www.nrm.org/2014/02/norman-rockwell-museum-welcomes-back-norman-rockwells-the-gossips/
I sometimes feel that Mark must have been a student of the teachings of Saul Alinsky because he seems to think much in that same direction. When did this becoming the bashing board against Trump? We really should, I guess, try to avoid all talk of politics at the highest level. Talk about the politics of raw milk and nothing more.
NJ Governor’s Agricultural Transition Team report:
This part is interesting: “Farmers also need access to new business development opportunities. New Jersey is the only State in the country without a law allowing home baked goods to be sold legally. The committee recommends joining the rest of the country to permit farmers and others to sell home baked goods based on other state models that protect public health.”
I stay off of here for awhile only to come back to the same ol’ same ol’. Please try to muster up what you can to get on point here regarding raw milk, food, etc. Please try to refrain from using such terms as “fascist,” “dictator,” etc. That’s all thrown out there just to evoke emotion and it is all BS. As far as the three part definition laid out in this article, the third prong is actually incorrect. The government does not control “industry and commerce.” “Industry and commerce” control the government (i.e., Big Dairy controls the FDA and Mr. Sheehan).
Whatever the case, after a full year of these rantings, maybe it’s time to move on from the Trump hate. Whadaya say? We’ve got bigger fish to fry here.
“Milk & Cookies”
How about using that as a call for raw milk?
New Jersey is the only one of seven States blocking access to raw milk.
Once more from the NJ Governors Ag Transition Report – “Farmers also need access to new business development opportunities. New Jersey is the only State in the country without a law allowing home baked goods to be sold legally. The committee recommends joining the rest of the country to permit farmers and others to sell home baked goods based on other state models that protect public health.”
As far as who controls whom, I think we’ve got a chicken-and-egg situation. FDA has good deal of legal and regulatory authority to affect the dairy industry, if it chooses to exercise that control. President and Congress have ultimate control–Congress controls FDA and other budgets, and President is the FDA’s (and USDA’s, etc.) boss and can tell HHS secretary what he wants FDA to emphasize and de-emphasize.
Cheesemaker,
Politics and food are infinitely intertwined in our country!!
Replace smoking cigarettes with drinking raw milk and this article sounds strikingly familiar to Bill Denby’s arrangement…
http://www.nugget.ca/2018/02/02/illegal-cigarettes-fund-the-activities-of-more-than-175-criminal-gangs-coalition-claims
Ken,
Does Ontario tax food? If not, I really do not see the connection other than “illegal”???? The article is about the supposed ripping off the government of taxes.
How does NOT paying taxes connect to Bill Denby?? If the consumers are happy with the arrangement and the distributor and producers are happy with the arrangement, so WHAT IS the problem?
I’m referring to the methods being used to make cigarettes or raw milk available to the general public… the taxes is a separate issue that I wasn’t addressing.
Although Denby is all over the place with his comments, he appears to have ignored and/or is continuing to defiantly ignore regulations, as well as take advantage of apparent loopholes… he states, “The role now is to go UNDER GROUND and set up a RAW MILK SUPPLY from Producer to END USER… I operate as the middle person to protect the suppliers from SPYS, you never get to meet the farmers or go to the farms. We have over 50 suppliers in the outer GTA (Greater Toronto Area) area and more wanting to start. If you need a steady supply of Raw milk to make cheese, butter, and drink, I CAN HELP call I am the only person that can pick up & deliver your milk safe, we have enclosed refrigerated Trailers to keep your RAW MILK COLD! I go to the GTA weekly and have many drop off sites! Tell your friends and family members! Thank you, Treasure Island Raw Milk Services.” And again in another comment he states, “I owned and operated a export /import business for dairy products from the USA to Canada for a number of years, there is nothing that I can clear at the border, even bottled Raw milk can enter Canada duty free unlimited in volumes! I have quite a history as a diary farmer/ importer / exporter, ask the DFO how glad they were to see me sell”. Hmmm the last I heard the only people that can bring product, namely cigarettes into Canada from the US duty free and sell it at a discount to the general public are the natives…
Ken,
If what he is supplying is CAFO milk, which there is no proof of at this point, that would be misleading on his part. And if someone gets ill from drinking that raw milk, who will the regulators come after? As far as import regulations in Canada, I do not have a clue, here, in the US, I have had to employ a “broker” to bring anything in from Canada. I had to do that when I bought a few items at Northshore Tractor in Echo Bay. ( If you need farm implements, Vic and Tom Fremlin are really good guys there at North Shore!!) If, in fact the milk turns out NOT to be CAFO milk, then what would be the problem with his method of distribution?
the problem is, that the BIG NOISE FROM KAWARTHA, is cheating 2 ways at onec’t … he has the protection of his cartel, so any genuine free-enterprisers with be put through the meat-grinder of Court, then cheating all the other tax slaves, who simply shut up and pay their income tax. Anticipating the squawks from BOOTLEGGER BILLY, let’s see your income tax returns for the 20 years you claim you were delivering milk to the Greater Trawna Area. I’ll bet another real silver dollar to a single TimBit that they do not report the massive $$$ you claim on this forum you took in all that time
Bear in mind, Billy, that infamous Al Capone never got caught for breaking the Prohibition laws … the Gman put him away for Tax Evasion. Confer with the case of Russel A Porisky, now doing federal time, after cheating RevScam and conspiring with others to Cheat, too
like you, I thought he could have it both ways … NOT pay tax on income, meanwhile, take advantage of the govt. benefits. Like you = I warned him about a decade before they took him away in handcuffs.
CORRECTION : further to my posting earlier, I should’a said : “HE thought he could have it both ways”, meaning, the so-called Natural Person scheme for evading income tax as promulgated by Big Daddy Russ Porisky. Like BOOTLEGGER BILL DENDY, Russel A Porisky was perfectly happy to take advantage of what he saw as a loophole in the income tax racket, all the while exploiting the ignorance of De-taxers … those blinded by ‘tax rage’, for serious amounts of ca$h. I
Denby being another opportunist, peddling raw milk for human consumption, even though he was not delivering the good stuff. “The good stuff”, being = what we call REAL MILK. Bill Denby and his cartelists are cut from the same cloth as corporate bandits who never did a thing to educate consumers, – all the while me and my friends were doing the heavy lifting to bring about change in farming practices, for a couple of decades – then shamelessly mis-appropriated the term. Do you really believe the Red Chinese care about abiding-by labelling laws in America? Same goes for his UNDERGROUND network of raw milk suppliers from CAFO farms. His quota holding pals happily taking the fund$ as they turn a blind eye to the pathogens in their bulk tanks – are the antithesis of what the Campaign for REAL MILK is doing.
politics sure does make strange bedfellows, don’t it? ! Seeing the Wicked Witch of the Cooked Milk lobby, M McG M, fawning over him! … speaks volumes.
Virginia:
https://news.google.com/news/video/uS0fdM71N0o/dmaZqrFr0cEzZsM?hl=en&gl=US&ned=us
can anyone tell me some names of “big ag” farms
if we can get a bunch of well known companies that sell cereal …cookies…baking mixes to mention on they’re boxes how great their product would taste having it with raw milk…instead of the usual “milk” would this be ok.
would there be any legal implications towards these companies..
As far as I know there has been no crackdown on raw milk, or uninspected meat sales in Lancaster Pa and this county is the largest provider in the U.S .A supplier that was accused of supplying milk that made a person ill in New Jersey had a little problem for a while but they are now back in business .I believe it was the Obama administration that took Amos Miller to court for selling raw milk and uninspected meat .Insinuating that the government is going fascist by enforcing health laws is a little disturbing to me.It appears that large companies follow the healh laws for the most part and do not get special treatment from the government to help put small outfits out of business .President Trump has eliminated a lot on unnecessary regulations that hurt small business since he took over . President Trump is trying to move this country in the right direction lets all give hom a chance,and stop partisan politicts on this blog ,stick to raw milk comments .
William March,
Please turn on your GPS….you are a bit lost.
Let me help you a little. ( a very long story made very short )
The USDA delayed the entry of CA into the Federal Milk Pool System because of a weird lawsuit about use of ALJS. Administrative Law Judges ( ALJ ) have been used by the USDA since for-ever to supervise hearings at Federal Milk Pool proceedings.
Because of your dear friend Mr. Sonny Perdue at the USDA and our president, the entire USDA is now shut down pending a supreme court ruling to see if an ALJ can preside over simple hearings.
If that is progress and you like that kind of action by taking down federal agencies, then turn off the GPS and stay lost.
There are 1350 dairies in CA that have voted ( 87% FOR ) to join the Federal Order System only to be placed on hold for many months as the supreme court decides on something that has been settled for 40 years!!!
The Lawsuit is between the writer of the book “Art of the Deal” and a guy named ” Buckets of Money”. It is all so Trumpian. Flaky weirdo’s destroying our institutions and rules that structure our country.
If you love this…then get Trump to buy a private island move there with him and kiss his ring.
MARK , Thanks for your advice ,I will now make sure my GPS is turned on in all my vehicles .I am sure the courts will solve the California milk problem .of which I have no knowledge .The only Perdue I am concerned with is the ckicken man ,Sonny Perdue is new to his job give him a chance. As far as President Trump is concerned thank God he was elected by the working class and the so called deplorables in this country I do not want my country controled by elites that think their POOP dosent stink . Your buddy Barak Obama has done more to destroy this country than any President in my lifetime ,he divided the races ,he put men against women ,he changed the marriage act (after he was elected the second time)he was friends with many radicales including Rev Wright ,Bill Ayres ,and Louis Farrakhan and I could keep on going .I do not vote by party ,I vote for the best qualified person at the time I vote .I could not vote for Hillary even though she is considered the worlds smartest women,by some elitest fools.You should read Trumps book THE ART OF THE DEAL it might help with your problem in California .AGAIN THANKS TO THE AMERICAN WORKING PEOPLE FOR ELECTING DONALD TRUMP PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA .
William.
Please get a PET Scan, MRI or CAT Scan. Perhaps all three….something is so wrong. I have the deepest respect for Obama and his ethics and moral leadership. So does the rest of the world. He could not do what he needed to do because of Congress blocking him at his every breathe.
I have pledged to go high. Enough said. You have drank the lemonade. By the way… that PET, CAT or MRI won’t be covered by insurance. That was taken away by your savior in chief.
Trump now wants a military parade with tanks ( the road will need to be repaved ) marching soldiers and missile carriers down 5th Avenue so he can show North Korea a thing or two.
William….do you see who you are praising? Please awaken.
God help us all.
which god would that be? to whom you’re appealing for assistance? Not the God of Israel, namely Jesus Christ. Barry Suetoro aka Barrack O’ Bama, disavowed that one, when he converted to Mohammedan-ism. Our God, is a jealous God… He won’t be helping His enemies
Donald trump is merely searching for buttons to push and the button with your name on it Mark is well lubricated and sticks out like a sore thumb.
“Obama’s ethics and moral leadership” … beyond parody!! Surely you’re not serious???? A sodomite who ponced-around playing the role as head of the government, with a transvestite for his consort, reading his lines from a telepromter for 8 years … as the country degenerated so badly that the classic “man on a white horse” could ride in to town, in the opening act of Dictatorship …and you expect us to take you seriously? Where’s the satirical genius that used to reside in Mad Magazine, when America needed it most? PRESIDENT TRUMP has one good thing going for ‘im ; he understands that his core constituency is = white folks who want a white man in the White House
Once again, the promise of perfection and guarantees of pasteurization safety fail again. https://www.fda.gov/Safety/Recalls/ucm594219.htm
Pasteurization is down right dangerous. It creates an environment that simply loves listeria. Lactalis in the EU going to lose hundreds of millions with plenty of sick kids from 12 years of pasteurized baby food tainted with salmonella in 83 countries.
I presented at Fresno State University yesterday at a food safety class. Interesting to note that the professor wanted to get another perspective on safety from the “RAMP risk management” lens. In the class….I asked how many times the FDA PMO requires testing of dairy products after pasteurization.
I was happy to see that a couple of students got it right…..a big fat Zero times. It would appear that there is a real problem. Prcessors are failing to check the process to assure effectiveness. Consumers are paying the price and so are the brands.
The FDA needs to show a little leadership here. That’s not possible for a few more years. Leadership means regulatory change and under this fool that won’t happen.
This evening I presented to group of special needs children’s parents. Down kids thrive on raw milk and don’t suffer from chronic ear infections or frequent colds when they drink raw milk. At tonight’s meeting one mom reported that her son fully recovered from Excema drinking raw milk and literally never had another cold his entire childhood after consuming raw milk.
This is the reason we believe in raw milk. It is health and prevention for everyone starting with kids. All kids.
since you say so, let’s start with the “kids”, eh? As you use the word “kids”, Mr McAffee, you mean “children”, right? And when you promote the drinking of raw milk for women who are pregnant, you’re aware that that woman is carrying a child, right? And part of your campaign to educate people about the benefits of REAL MILK, is ; that it’s a good thing for a pregnant woman to drink raw milk because the nutrients in it transfer to the child within her, right? So = out of your own experience as a paramedic and one of the world’s experts on the science to do with raw milk … not to mention a father and grandfather … you know beyond doubt, that a child within a pregnant woman – REGARDLESS of the gestational age – is a human being. Right? Yet you’ve stated on this forum you believe that executing such a child by an artificial abortion, is “a woman’s right to choose”. Double-minded=ness doesn’t get any more obvious than that.
See why I despise you, Mark McAffee ? Because you personify the moral turpitude of an entire class of Americans, who make mewling noises about ‘caring’ out of one side of their mouths, all the while averting their eyes from those same children being liquidated in abortion mills. Who go on about facilitating racial aliens invade our neighbourhoods, even while you condone white children being put to death within the abortion mills. And your pals in power send me and my friends to prison, for so much as bringing up within earshot of women going in to destroy those “kids” the fact that ABORTION IS MURDER
Yes, abortion is indeed murder and so is, infanticide, genocide, uxoricide, capital punishment and euthanasia… yet people continue to rationalize all of the above forms of murder for the sake of satisfying their greed and utilitarian driven self righteous indignation and complacency. All of which occurs under the supervision of God who created us with a free will…
As CS Lewis pointedly states, “If tribulation is a necessary element in the redemption we must anticipate that it will never cease till God sees the world to be either redeemed or no further redeemable. A Christian cannot, therefore, believe any of those who promise that if only some reform in our economic, political, or hygienic system were made, a heaven on earth would follow. This might seem to have a discouraging effect on the social worker, but it is not found in practice to discourage him. On the contrary, a strong sense of our common miseries, simply as men, is at least as good a spur to the removal of all the miseries we can, as any of those wild hopes which tempt men to seek their realisation by breaking the moral law and prove such dust and ashes when they are realised. If applied to individual life, the doctrine that an imagined heaven on earth as necessary for vigorous attempts to remove present evil, would at once reveal its absurdity.”
Kathy
what you report is a major element in what plagues America. ie =How the fundamentals of the food supply has been utterly poisoned, by stealth. Many people will accept that that’s gone on, for sheer commercial greed. But when guys like me start in with the proofs that i’ts been done wittingly – that there’s a greater conspiracy to do evil, often called “communism” … ordinary folks roll their eyes, preferring not to know.
Professor Marshal McLuhan taught us back in the 1960s : ‘when someone’s self-image is threatened, they have a mandate for war’. In the (so-called ) Prolife thing, back in the 1990s, I learned : this nation cannot tolerate serious scrutiny of its sins. So those whose consciences are pricked by the plain truth, retaliate against the messenger by calling down govt. force. When I and my friends publicized the FACT that remains of babies harvested from the abortuaries, was being sold disguised as “cord blood”, we were sent to gaol. Same thing often happens on the personal level. Which is why I excoriate Mark McAffee = there was no personality clash ’til he polluted this raw milk forum with his hyper-partisan political speech, then fled the field when I call out his hypocritical ‘virtue signalling’. Of course I’m aware this ain’t the place to go on about the abortion holocaust. That battle was lost in the 50s, when the God damned birth control pill hit the market. After which it all played out predictably.
I dredge that up to explain the premise of the spiritual battle : the Law of our God, versus the wiles of the Adversary on every front … right down to the milking parlor. Most of the people in the Campaign for REAL MILK, have no idea of the nature of the evil we’re up against. As the ancient Druids put it “the Truth against the World” Y gwir yn erbyn y byd
at this URL is a good analysis of an outbreak of campylobacter, from a legal herdshare in Colorado.
http://www.barfblog.com/2018/02/raw-is-risky-17-sick-with-campylobacter-from-raw-milk-in-colorado-2016/
it makes the point that = the problem was easily and quickly traceable to its source while the REAL MILK kept flowing in all the other perfectly-legal, non-affected herdshares.
now we’re getting somewhere …. the figures in this report are a good set of facts with which to begin properly analyzing overall risk of harm from consuming raw milk. When the enemies of REAL MILK gloat, we demand they compare this report with risk of harm from all other foodstuffs in commerce. Let’s see some real science, for a change.
and ( just because I can ) it’s worth noting that : were this kind of thing to happen with Bill Denby’s UNDERGROUND operation, bootlegging raw milk produced by thousands of cows on CAFOs, into the Greater Trawna Area … he wouldn’t know where to begin, tracking down the trouble
gordon
heres some food for thought (literally)
if you wanna run with it
i found out some ..but i had to stop
the bacillus
acidophollus and bifidus (once not to recently was called INFANTIS) cultures found in yogurt are from human origin
used from abortion clicincs ..core blood and adult cadavers for the acidophollus.
and there are more bacillus.
its in the yogurt cultures.they are “MODERN” cultures
way back when say 100 years ago they made soured milk by pouring it into animal skin bags and using animal intestines.
now its done this way
yogurt cultures are not made from the cheese making and yogurt supply mom and pop place.they are made in a lab.the lab harvests these bacillus from human intestines
when i finally found a lane or 2 that manufactures these yogurt cultures…i asked them where they come from
there response
“I’m sorry but thats proprietary information”
you can make cow upon cow bacillus yogurt by clabbering the milk adding more cream and fresh lemon juice
sorry meant “LAB” not “LANE”
Kathy,
Do you have a link so I can read about this?
no john because its covert operation.its not advertised or no one i believe would eat the yoghurt.
got my information from a guy from pakisatan
when i did find something related to this it was regarding core blood cells (2012 was the year)i found this report on the internet. umbilical cord blood has the bacteria called INFANTIS…since then they have changed this name to BIFIDUS.one of the uses was to get the bacillus infantis from the core blood and use it in yoghurt cultures.
modern type cultures are on the market and they are pretty freaky john.
like i said back then 100 years anymore they uses animal intestines ,animal skin bags to pour they’re fresh milk in it when they traveled it soured ..got thicker ..they drank it.
I’m thinking theres gotta be cultures from tribes for yoghurt that have possibly never left they’re living area..because of religious reasons..monks …dali lama etc…that are still REAL CULTURES not tampered with
that article has since been “taken down” i think
Kathy,
I figured as much, LOL!!! Thank You!!
Mark, how long do you think we will be able to enjoy the benefits of raw milk and abate immune malfunction disorders such as “eczema using your above mentioned “RAMP risk management lens”, if Government administrations, (including Obama’s administration when he was at the helm), continue to capitulate and sanction ever increasing regulations and mandates that results in the adulteration of food via “pasteurization”, genetic modification and the use of pesticides and herbicides, both of which have biocidal and bactericidal qualities and all of which impedes and undermine our symbiotic relationship with surrounding ecosystems, not to mention their toxic and detrimental effect on the nervous and endocrine system?
Mark ,Thank you for advising me to get the scans you recommend, I have had many over the last several years . As far as your remarks on pasteurized milk,you know as well as I do that the contamination of milk occurs after being pasteurized . The milk is contaminated by improper handling or by adding an extra ingredient to the milk .Pasteurized milk has no live pathogens as it leaves the pasteuizer .Panera Bread had the same problem only one variety of their cream cheese was contaminated, probably by adding nuts or fruit ,although they recalled all varieties .By the way Panera advertises that their food is 100% clean and is real food sounds familiar,I guess that accounts for the high prices they charge .The same thing happened in Europe with the powdered baby formula ,it was contaminated in the storage tanks . If you find that drinking raw milk prevents the common cold ,which is caused by a virus ,please let me know ,I would like to get in on the action I could use the $$$$$.
Dear Wiliam,
Please see the PubMed peer reviewed articles and research done by Loss and Von Mutius at LMU in Germany. They found that raw milk consumption by children reduced the incidence of colds ( virus infections ) by 30%. Not to mention reduction of ear infections.
Ken….. I do not share the pessimism of raw milk being oppressed in the way it may seem in other places around America. In CA pasteurized milk is in decline while raw milk is the rising consumer beloved all star of the dairy case. At least in stores that carry it.
It all starts with the will of the people. People make and change the laws. If people let processors run their lives because people fail to show up, stand up and speak up…..that’s a people problem. I saw this years ago in Colorado when 300 people showed up and changed the law and made cow shares legal. I have seen this in uncounted additional places. The worst trait of people is their lack of will to act. Sitting around and pissing and moaning is not acting. Acting is doing something with others to cause change.
Action is something I deeply respect. The only thing I respect more is the persistent action of those that fail….when they stand up and act again only with more ferocity.
Safe Raw milk….is here to stay and it is emerging internationally. It will stay because we now know how to make it safely and manage its risks.
Risk management is not sexy or easy. It is hard work. But if you learn and apply this new risk management language, those in positions of power will respect you and progress will be made. Change is hard….in nature things that fail to adopt and change die off.
This presents itself as a real problem for the germaphobes of this world… Read it and weep Bill Marler.
“Millions Of Viruses And Bacteria Raining Down On Earth Every Day And We Don’t Even Know It”
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/220585/20180208/millions-of-viruses-and-bacteria-raining-down-on-earth-every-day-and-we-don-t-even-know-it.htm
“According to a new study by scientists from the University of British Columbia, more than 800 million viruses per square meter remain swirling in the Earth’s upper troposphere. Researchers also found that billions of viruses and tens of millions of bacteria are deposited per square meter each day.”
We are a Bacteriosapiens and we have gone VIRAL!!
Owe…to be at one with our mother earths biosphere!
Raw milk has all the precious living things we need to thrive!
Eating clean now means adding a little raw organic dirt with an earthworm or two!!
I can hear the paramedics sirens rolling to see Bill right now…chest pain due to nightmarish thoughts of bacteria being good.
Our dear friend USDA Secretary of Ag Sonny Perdue is holding a town hall meeting on Tuesday at the Tulare CA International Farm Expo. All seats on a reserved basis. I reserved three seats. But….no confirmation yet. I wonder if they do back ground checks prior to issuing the reservations??
There are a whole lot of not so happy CA dairymen that want to talk to him about a range of subjects:
1. USDA stopping all progress on the CA Fed Milk Order entry that was supported by 87% of CA dairies in our Dec vote!
2. Total non enforcement of the USDA organic pasture rule allowing 16,000 cow CAFO operations to kill organic markets!
3. USDA lack of support for a meaningful farm bill that would control inventory of milk in the USA and stabilize dairies. We are losing more than a dairy each week in CA. Losing a dairy a day in Wisconsin. When you lose dairies you lose the mid food chain cash flow system that supports local Ag economies.
And plenty more big issues. It will be interesting to see what he has to say to a bunch of conservative farmers that feel betrayed by Trumps hollow promises and among that seated sea of conservatives…..one buried little organic raw milk guy. Gonna be exciting ! If I pass the back ground check to get into the meeting. I have a clean criminal record….but I don’t think that matters to this admin. I think it is about right wing ring kissing. My record on that side is dismal.
#MOOTOO Perhaps our raw milk movement could benefit by #MOOTOO
see you on Facebook…
According to this American Council on Science and Health article, it appears that most of us, because we drink raw milk, are flunking on a daily basis this madcap’s devised and bizarre IQ test…
https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/02/09/drinking-raw-milk-flunking-iq-test-12557
Ken,
I tried to leave a comment but the technology was not supported by my device. I saw your comment. Well done
Pretty condescending comment for a Phd in biology to make. That means he flunked the PUBMED RAWMilk IQ test for sure.
Any researcher worth his salt would have done his homework. He did not do his. He got As in school by repeating rhetoric and doing his own research.
He missed the last 20 years of genomics, and EU peer reviewed PubMed published raw milk research. He totally missed the RAWMI food safety website and totally missed the class on Breast Milk Day. The jokes on him….lets give him a good laugh.
When he gets Crohns, IBS, weak bones, loose teeth, asthma, excema, allergies….who will be hurting then. Phd maybe….really bright, not so much. Scientists are supposed to be relentless researchers and critical thinkers. He needs to study biodiversity and epi genetics with a little milk genomics plus gut biome study.
Raw milk not a moneymaker for farmers who chance it
Few area farmers have leapt on trend
http://www.cadillacnews.com/news/raw-milk-not-a-moneymaker-for-farmers-who-chance-it/article_b647e224-2906-5cf4-8d55-edf3c57b4cda.html
Dr. Heckman,
That article is misleading, I live in Michigan and our state attorney general sanctioned herd shares several years ago( with the help of Ted and Peggy Beals and others too), they are not illegal here. Though the state desires written contracts, not all farmers do that. I know of a few doing herd shares, but these are more in the northern part of the state, my supplier WILL NOT sign a contract, they are afraid of legalities surrounding a legal contract, I do not really understand their perspective, but I don’t have to. My suppliers milk grass fed Jerseys, been doing it for over 30 years and raised two children on it and their grand children drink it now too. I have to admit, theirs is the best I’ve ever drank.
Ken,
I read the article, another naysayer, I tried to post, but the site says someone else has my e-mail address, so could not post, wanted to send him to CDC stats on deaths from pasteurized dairy products. Also wanted to tell him what the French would think about him wanting to eliminate raw milk cheese, LOL!! Riot time in France!! Thanks Ken for your postings there. Why don’t they try an IQ test at McDonalds restaurants???
The Cadillac News article really was not well researched and was very superficial. They did not call me or anyone at RAWMI. We are all doing great. When others say it is impossible to do raw milk….that’s awesome marketing news to me. Michigan State professor really has not done his homework. When others claim raw milk is too hard to do….that makes me feel cozy warm and quite happy.
When we have 1000 stores carrying raw milk, cheese butter, cream and Kefir with Test & Hold PCR BAX testing and safety technology and growing strong, it is clear that the Michigan professor does not get out much. The third ranked brand of organic milk is raw….the good professor needs to come visit us in CA and a RAWMI dairy or 15.
If a farmer wants to be successful selling raw milk….they must be deducted to teaching raw milk. If you don’t teach….you won’t sell.
With organic and conventional dairies in desparate times….raw milk is showing all th signs of being the long term dairy supply for people that drink or eat dairy. It is simply not possible for a dairy to produce long term and lose money every day. Thats what has happened to conventional dairies for the last 4 years and prices are getting worse and worse. Organic dairies are dying off as well because of massive rampant Pasture Rule cheating and over supply from CAFO operations.
Go ahead and say that raw milk is impossible….best news all day.
The Importance of Infants’ Exposure to Micro-Organisms
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/05/well/live/infant-microbiome-cesarean-childbirth-breastfeeding.html
Regarding Cadillac News,
For another perspective on raw milk I emailed Dr. Elliot Ryser at Michigan State U. a link to my publication:
Securing fresh food from fertile soil, challenges to the organic and raw milk movements
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/renewable-agriculture-and-food-systems/article/securing-fresh-food-from-fertile-soil-challenges-to-the-organic-and-raw-milk-movements/18325E375E068A538E07EF4E6F6ABA22
One Hundred Years Later-Milk Safety Revisited
https://www.nature.com/articles/pr1999854
With respect to that American Council on Science and Health article I shared with you entitled, “Drinking Raw Milk Is Flunking IQ Test”; here is an update on the comments…
https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/02/09/drinking-raw-milk-flunking-iq-test-12557
Sharyl Attkisson update on her lawsuit against the federal government. over its computer intrusions —and how it all relates to current events.
Ken,
Wonderful response!!! You get an “atta boy”, LOL!! All kidding aside, I really like your comment to the naysayers.
“Conservative estimates of the effect of pasteurizing all fluid milk at 82 C rather than 72 C are that annual listeriosis deaths from consumption of this milk would increase from 18 to 670, a 38-fold increase”
(page 703) “These changes to the potential for outgrowth have been calculated to increase the risk of death from listeriosis due to consumption of pasteurized fluid milk by approximately 40-fold. Such an increase would have an appreciable public health impact if all milk in the United States were processed according to the increased pasteurization temperature based on the fact that milk is estimated to be responsible for approximately 18 listeriosis deaths per year in the United States.”
Stasiewicz, M.J., N. Martin, S. Laue, Y.T. Grohn, K.J. Boor, and M. Wiedmann. 2014. Responding to bioterror concerns by increasing milk pasteurization temperature would increase estimated annual deaths from listeriosis. J. Food Prot, 77:696-705.
Massive outbreak of antimicrobial-resistant salmonellosis traced to pasteurized milk
C. A. Ryan et al., JAMA. Vol. 258 No. 22, December 11, 1987
Centers for Disease Control, Atlanta, GA 30333.
Two waves of antimicrobial-resistant Salmonella typhimurium infections in Illinois totaling over 16 000 culture-confirmed cases were traced to two brands of pasteurized 2% milk produced by a single dairy plant. Salmonellosis was associated with taking antimicrobials before onset of illness. Two surveys to determine the number of persons who were actually affected yielded estimates of 168,791 and 197,581 persons, making this the largest outbreak of salmonellosis ever identified in the United States. The epidemic strain was easily identified because it had a rare antimicrobial resistance pattern and a highly unusual plasmid profile; study of stored isolates showed it had caused clusters of salmonellosis during the previous ten months that may have been related to the same plant, suggesting that the strain had persisted in the plant and repeatedly contaminated milk after pasteurization.
Outbreak of Listeria monocytogenes Infections Associated with Pasteurized Milk from a Local Dairy – Massachusetts, 2007
From CDC’s MMWR:
On November 27, 2007, a local health officer in central Massachusetts contacted the Massachusetts Department of Public Health (MDPH) to report listeriosis in a man aged 87 years. Pulsed-field gel electrophoresis (PFGE) performed on the patient’s Listeria monocytogenes isolate produced a pattern indistinguishable from that of isolates from three other cases identified in residents of central Massachusetts in June, October, and early November 2007. MDPH, in collaboration with local public health officials, conducted an investigation, which implicated pasteurized, flavored and nonflavored, fluid milk produced by a local dairy (dairy A) as the source of the outbreak. This report summarizes the results of that investigation. In all, five cases were identified, and three deaths occurred. This outbreak illustrates the potential for contamination of fluid milk products after pasteurization and the difficulty in detecting outbreaks of L. monocytogenes infections.
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/301/8/820.extract
And on top of ALL that Dr. Heckman, it tastes like something I usually spread on my hay fields :>)
TAKE ACTION: Tell Trump to Help Family Farmers—Lift the FDA’s Ban on Raw Milk
https://action.organicconsumers.org/o/50865/p/dia/action4/common/public/?action_KEY=21499
Pastuerized milk is contaminated after it has been pastuerized THATS A FACT .Any food item whether organic or conventionally processed can be compromised by improperly handling that goes for meat ,milk ,pizza ,or keifer thats another fact ,for that reason we have food inspection.We should help all farmers with their milk sales not just raw milk farmers .Juice made from nuts and other ingredients is called MILK , it is not milk and should be called juice ,we should work to get that changed ,that would help all dairy farmers .John Dutcher says pastuerized milk is like something he puts on his hay fields ,there is no reason for comments like that .Pastuerized and raw milk are both good products ,they are both good sources of nutrition ,neither one prevents or cures diease or illness .New types of good milk are coming available ,a new product now on the market is FAIRLIFE MILK it has less sugar ,more protein more nutrition ,its a new type of milk ,things do change throughout life, as we all know ..
William March,
You sir, do NOT have the RIGHT to tell me what to think or print: John Dutcher says pastuerized milk is like something he puts on his hay fields ,there is no reason for comments like that. Pasteurized milk tastes like SHIT!! Would not drink it!! Will not drink it, it is swill with added titanium dioxide!! Fairlife—fake milk!! You drink waht you like and I will drink what I like, capische??? You must be gov. shill!!
Be careful on your shouting-type-face FACTS William. This link below clearly reveals you as wrong. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC203888/
Abstract:
“Milk from cows inoculated with Listeria monocytogenes was pooled for 2 to 4 days and then heated at 71.7 to 73.9 degrees C for 16.4 s or at 76.4 to 77.8 degrees C for 15.4 s in a high-temperature, short-time plate heat exchanger pasteurization unit. L. monocytogenes was isolated from milk after heat treatment in six of nine pasteurization trials done at 71.7 to 73.9 degrees…
Results indicate that under the conditions of this study, L. monocytogenes can survive the minimum high-temperature, short-time treatment (71.7 degrees C, 15 s) required by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration for pasteurizing milk.
If you explore the right side bar of the PebMed site you’ll find at least 5 other published studies reporting findings with the same disturbing, irrefutable evidence of thermal resistance of Listeria Monocytogones.
blessings,
Edwin Shank
edwin@thefamilycow.com
Edwin, Thank YOU!!
Outbreak of Listeria monocytogenes Infections Associated with Pasteurized Milk from a Local Dairy – Massachusetts, 2007
“In all, five cases were identified, and three deaths occurred.”
If you the article read beyond the abstract, it gets really interesting:
“records indicate that pasteurization methods at the dairy were adequate”
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/301/8/820.extract
@ J. Heckman: Good find.
JAMA – a medical journal posing as authoratative and the AMA – an organization posing as an association representing the medical people. Both are bad jokes. JAMA allows ghostwritten articles and the AMA has never really “done” anything except con people by misinforming them in the name of “America”.
You are right, however, it gets pretty dern interesting!
Edwin ,Look up study High Temperature Short Time Pasteurization Inativates Listeria Monocytogenes dated Dec.1 1989 and if you have the time you will find many more studies with simular results .The contamination of the milk in Massachusetts happened after the milk was pasteurized .Milk that has been pasteurized and handled properly is safe to drink .
John Dutcher , YOU ARE RIGHT I have no right to stop you from showing how ignorant you are .I see you learned a new word ‘capisce’let me know if you would like some more ethnic words .I would suggest you find some product that contains titanium dioxide and try it instead of putting it on your hay fields .By the way I cannot find it in any pasteurized milk I have looked at in the stores .As I have said many times before I have nothing against raw milk and have sold many gallons in the past , My problem is belittling milk that most people drink which is pasteurized ,if you like the taste of raw milk than drink it ,If you believe the anecdotal properties of raw milk thats up to you .
benefits of
Your a comedian William March!! You should hush while your ahead, for it is better for ALL to think you are fool, than it is to open your mouth and remove all doubt!!
William March I hate to break the news to you, but you have about ZERO credibility on this forum. That’s all good but please stop insulting other people by telling them how ignorant they are because that’s what we think of you. Read the links that have been posted here and educate yourself. Seems the vast majority of us think you are a troll, a plant or both. Have a great weekend and gloat.
John Dutcher ,Please accept my sincere apology I should not have referred to you as I did
again I apologize .Bill
Gonna be hard to accept it,William March, you are not a good hearted person!!, but I WILL try!!