It is encouraging to learn from Mark McAfee of Organic Pastures Dairy Co. about the growing acceptance among scientific researchers in California of raw milk (per his comments following my previous post).
I have written in the past about the open-mindedness of the International Milk Genomics Consortium at the University of California in Davis to the idea that raw milk provides health benefits.
But even though the Consortium bills itself as international, the reality is that it holds much more sway in California than it does in, say, Illinois or South Dakota. Major trends generally begin in California, don’t they?
I wrote recently about the devious actions of the Illinois Department of Public Health in its ongoing effort to tighten regulations regarding raw milk sales, in the absence of any hint of a public health problem.
Now, the same kind of deception appears to be going on in South Dakota, After proposing new tightening in that state earlier this year–to such an extent that the new requirements for permits and such would likely put many of the few remaining dairies out of business–state agriculture authorities seemed to back off in the face of public opposition. The notion that they were listening seems to have been a mirage. Now, the South Dakota Department of Agriculture has sent to the legislature the same very tight regulations that were first proposed months ago, and met heavy public opposition.
Unfortunately, that is more the norm than what Mark McAfee is observing in California. The governor of Wisconsin has expressed yet again his likely opposition to any raw milk bill in Wisconsin. His statement follows on vetoes of raw milk legislation in Maine and Nevada.
The reality is that the public health community, prodded by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, remains committed to the industry line, which is that raw milk is a threat to the established processed milk industry. That is understandable. The dairy industry is essentially an oligopoly–it consists of a few huge processors. Oligopolies thrive on controlling their markets, not opening them up to competition.
The good news is that availability of raw dairy is decided on a state-by-state basis. Because there are fifty states, there are fifty different sets of laws and regulations. Its up to residents of each state to determine their own fate.
**
I received a batch of photos Larry Otting took of his friend Aajonus Vonderplanitzs Thailand farm, and I have posted a few here. One can begin to appreciate why Vonderplanitz loved the place as much as he did. One can also appreciate the terrible fall he took from the deck. From the photo above, you see that he made sure to secure his raw milk supply over there.
I take three messages from this dairy industry editorial Shelly-D links to:
1. They are beginning to take the food rights movement seriously.
2. They are worried–this is clear when the executive says that “the trend is going in the wrong direction.”
3. They are re-committed to fighting raw milk with everything they have, which begins to explain why ag and public health officials in Illinois and South Dakota retreated from concessions they had made. They got the word from industry that it’s hard-ass time–no concessions allowed, period.
I haven’t seen that website you refer to yet. What is the change they want to make on the labels of non-dairy products? If you would be so kind as to give an example of what it is now and what it would likely become, I would appreciate it.
Thanks,
Ingvar
I did notice in the article at the link posted by Shelly-D that the 40 year gubment sponger, er, veteran of health inspection had to drag out the old chestnut using the *150 cases of food-borne illnesses* which has been debunked at least a dozen times already. I mean, really, these guys either believe their “science” and their beloved CDC statistics or they don’t, but most of them straddle the fence, just like this guy did.
The organizations that make up the Wisconsin Milk Safety Coalition(the anti-health lobby) include:
American Academy of Pediatrics.
Childrens Hospital of Wisconsin.
Marshfield Clinic.
Wisconsin Medical Society.
WALHDAB – Partnering to Improve Public Health.
Wisconsin Public Health Association.
Wisconsin Veterinary Medical Association.
etc etc etc
http://realfoodlaw.com/2013/03/06/so-called-milk-safety-coalition-opposes-legalization-of-raw-milk-sales-in-wisconsin/
To me, labeling at this point means nothing anyway because there is so much untruth out there. I simply don’t believe a lot of what goes onto a label so I hardly ever buy anything canned or boxed. Russ makes a good point about the GMO’s and that’s only part of why I’m leery of labeling.
I made no bones in my recent letter to the SDDA (in support of raw milk and asking them to wait for statutory authority from the LRC) about the fact that my family will not be purchasing ANY milk or milk products made by bigdairy if SD passes this ridiculous set of regulations, or worse, bans raw milk all together. We will simply not be bullied by the corporate bigdairy creeps, and will make our own almond milk (but I didn’t tell them that!). We can live just fine without bigdairy stuff, and so can many others, so this could turn out to be step backwards for them in the long run.
Oddly, we also have lightning and thunder – loud thunder, and yet there is such a whiteout blizzard going that I cannot see the neighbor’s home from time to time. We have a generator for the fridge and stuff, but if the power company doesn’t get to us today it’s gonna be a long, chilly night. Luckily the temps are not going to be too terribly frigid – only about 28 degrees overnight, or so they’re saying. We also have a transistor radio to help get updates on the weather once it gets dark. We live in a canyon and when daylight is done for the day, it’s as dark as the inside of an inkwell. It’s been a very strange day and one of the earliest blizzards I can remember in some time. Pretty but it’s gonna be costly in many ways.
During and after the International Milk Genomics Consortium convention at UC Davis meetings between myself and representatives from UC Davis research communities and other very influential very conected organizations met together. Yes….believe it or not… peacefully and in the same room. Suffice it to say that big bridges are being built and trust is being extended. When I am asked to give political cover and not to use or refer to names because of heat that is being created by the sheer mention of RAWMILK market emergence, then that is when you know that real & great progress is being made.
I am currently colaborating by sharing ( generic, no names used to identify the sources ) RAWMI RAMP LISTING coliform test data with non-UC Davis researchers and pathogen experts that are very connected to the highest levels of the FDA and industry. They have said that data will drive opinion and political positions. I know that the five producers that are LISTED have remarkable data. Raw Milk coliform data that has truely never been created before ever…ever. This will be assessed and graphed into presentable information that can then be utilized to prove our notion that raw milk can be reliably produced as a truly low risk food. This is a huge step in the bridge building direction. It is very clear to everyone that: conditions management, food safety plan management and application of testing is the alternative to investment in a pasteurizer if Raw is the goal. With the disasterous decline of fluid pasteurized milk….dollar voting says it all. Some people want clean delicious raw milk! It is also clear that more and more people will not drink or can not drink pasteurized milk and industry has not really found a solution, but….we have. It is called clean fresh raw milk with all of the goodies still inside and alive.
This is an exciting time with real friends that will lose their jobs if they come out in official support of raw milk. This is truly all about a change of paradigm and all about money. Time, trust building, bridge biulding, solid data and a track record combined with a growing and thriving raw milk market will change this scene….
RAWMI LISTED dairymen, as few as they are….truly have some data that shows what can happen with a plan and some simple tests. Now this data has become our greatest tool….
I say tool…several years ago perhaps I would have said weapon. I think that the war in California has entered a new phase. It is an educational, scientific and market building challenge now. Time….just lots of constant effort and time. The track record is undeniable and now that data is being shared and accepted by people at the highest levels. Wow. I am humbled and very thankful. Someday the states will fall like dominos. Then the greater challenge will happen. Just because raw milk laws will change…will the producers truly understand what it takes to be at the level of being LISTED and take full responsibility?
Let us all hope that producers that produce raw milk do it for the right reasons and take the ethical high ground. If not their lives will not exist long in the raw milk world. This is brutal and there will be little room for anything but focussing on your plan, conditions and testing. No longer will ignorance be bliss. Knowledge, plans and information will be the expectation and order of the day, as it should be.
Once again we see the difference between the mindset of freedom and democracy and that which seeks to legitimate this or that within the corporatist framework.
(I wouldn’t have bothered commenting on this again, but the brazen extolling of elitist secrecy and contempt for democratic transparency antagonized me. That’s a subject very close to my heart these days.)
As Cdn author Mordecai Richler put it “let us compare theologies”. Meaning = it would help if you’d post a precis with : what state of the Union you’re in, a summary of the legality of REAL MILK where you are …and how much REAL MILK is flowing locally, directly consequent from your own efforts?
Reason I’m so irritated by those who criticize Mark McAffee, is : I suffered the same syndrome = cheap shots tossed in to the fray, especially, alluding to violence as a solution, by guys who “never heard a shot fired in anger” [ as my old man used to put it ] In the (so-called) Pro_life thing, and the DeTax thing, etc, where I was on the front lines, these kind of noises were very suspect = likely from govt. plants agitating to move simpletons to do something counter-productive.
The Detax thiing being the handiest example. Just last week the Cdn government got the icon they’d worked-at for 15 years = a photo of a “Freeman on the Land, dishevelled, obviously de-ranged, taken away in handcuffs. Now, he’s the cartoon badguy, and the nonsense he mouthed is used to discredit anyone who dares raise a voice against the iniquitous income tax.
Similarly : the oxy-morons who run Home-Land security would love nothing better than a made-for-media armed standoff around some raw milk farmer’s “compound” … be assured they’ve got it scripted
On this forum previously, I related the tale of mobster Sam Giancanna, who, at the end of his life, was asked what he’d do differently. he said “I’d get a licence”, : along with poet Dylan’s advice “you’ve got to serve somebody”. Point being : get used to the FACT that the American dream morphed into a nightmare, and not by accident. The existential problem is = how to come to terms with a system so unutterably diabolical, that one is hindered by its monstrosity being incredible. Yet one must. That is – if you want to get any worthwhile results so as to enjoy life at all. for me, that means, the satisfaction of putting REAL MILK in the hands of those who need it, ie. our children. Next ; proving that ‘immune milk’ is one of the most miraculous discoveries of all time
That same sage said “the man who lives outside the law, must be honest”…. so if you want to do it that way, feel free. But don’t come crying to me when Ruby Ridge / Waco and the end of Gordon Kahl, plays out in your neighbourhood
no, I am not saying you have to do what I did / continue to do = contend with the idiots + communists in high places. which happens to be my calling – There are different strokes for different folks … what I do say is = get out in the community, and produce something other than verbiage. If a gallon of raw milk is 20 bucks at the retail, then that’s the free market informing you that’s what it takes to make it happen.
I go back so far, I remember Nikita Kruschev at the UN, boasting “we will bury you!”, predicting the commies would “bury” America by out-producing us. yeah, well, how did that turn out, eh? (Bill Anderson et al.) The Campaign for REAL MILK is being won, first and last, by people who make it available today, one way or another. Thus making fools of all the socialist central- planners
I salute you, the yeomanry of America – every one of you whose heart is in this labor of love.
My computer is only running now because DH put the little Stanley portable power station on it to charge the battery, but it has only been charging long enough to give me about 1/2 hour of time.
Funny thing is that tomorrow is supposed to be 50 and MOnday is supposed to be 55 degrees and sunny. The next issue will, most definitely, be flooding. The canyon we live in has a stream running through it not far from our front door. I would imagine we will have much damage if the water gets too high. If it ain’t one thing, it’s something else. But we’re alive, we have plenty of food, we’re using the great outdoors for a deep freeze for foods and stuff, and we’re staying warm inside with the burners on our gas kitchen stove. We have no fireplace (DH hates those). We are able to survive nicely, although many in town are not as lucky. If we could get out of the canyon we would love to be helping, but I don’t want to risk having to be fined, or go to jail, for trying to be a good samaritan. Our local national guard is no help because they’re all overseas. Imagine that. But I’m not bitter . . .
If you want to change this crazy system, then a track record of safety and a robust consumer market is imperative end of story. Change happens with engagement and hard as facts. That means hard proof of our position and track record. Underground is just fine….but do not expect to make paradigm shifting change that way. Those that know me know better… I support small and big raw milk alike as long as the mindset is focused on excellence and safety. Throw your tomatoes I could care less.
Mark is prosecuting one front. There are multiple fronts in this war over food, food that should nourish, and be the end of many health problems and diseases, legacy foods that small family operations can profitably can raise and market across the globe. Theories of disease are involved. We live by the millions in cities across the world. We have also that lawyer with the ecolihus sidekick and their ilk to think about.
Let alone legislation that seemingly is pro clean delicious raw milk but in reality is an attempt to give clean delicious raw milk concrete overshoes, if you get my drift.
Aajonus prosecuted a different front, the right to choose healthy food because if he couldnt get it, he wouldve died a long, long, time ago.
James Stewart took action of a different sort and Rawesome was awesome, every Wednesday and Saturday.
Time propels us steadily, unstoppably.
There IS a lot to sort out, and it needs sorting out in depth but (and here you can see the clock factor), Aajonus needed the right food to simply live, if he waited for the thinkers to sort things out, he would have passed from this life a long, long, time ago. So moms with growing kids need. the. food. on. the. table. now. Moms and Dads to be, ditto. Just by this circumstance of time is of the essence of this matter, is a great message: get out of the way, let us vote our votes, vote our dollars, vote with our feet, with our freedom. Or are we free? Are our lives distorted by base commercial interests (misusing) the law, legislation, regulation as market cudgels? What States Legislature invented the cow? What Governor invented milking? What Judge orders the grass to grow in the earth, fed by sun and rain? What hubris. What nonsense. What #$%^.
Have a nice day!
Mr. J. Ingvar Odegaard
I’m happy to give McAfee credit for the things that he’s done, and in the same way criticize the things which deserve criticism. Anyone who knows the slightest bit about history knows that secret meetings among Our Betters always end in one way only, and that anyone claiming to be a Leader who says “I along with the rest of Your Betters will be meeting to solve this, the rest of you can go back to sleep” is really planning to sell out the rank and file.
That’s exactly what we can expect to start happening with the GMO labeling movement, as soon as state policies start being enacted. That’s exactly what I’m going to try to fight. The raw milk movement had better do the same.
But if you disagree then go ahead and continue with your implicit Leader-worship. We’ve seen how well that works.
That’s a standard ploy. If all the people who allegedly wanted to do this or that would publicly stand and be counted, the things would be done. But these are always really co-optation scams among criminals who are losing confidence in brute force, but have no intention of simply giving up their criminality. Thus Walmart, General Mills, and others have had meetings with central government officials about a sham federal GMO labeling policy whose only real effect would be to pre-empt stronger state policies.
But no such meeting has ever led to an outcome which would actually be good for the people.
THAT is reality.
If this is an honest discussion, why would anyone need it to be secret?
“how many cows they’re milking” Are you saying you are a dairy farmer?
“a summary of the legality of REAL MILK where you are” In Wisconsin we have incidental sales not in the regular course of business directly from the farm where the milk is produced. In other words; in Wisconsin it is legal for a dairy farmer to sell any raw milk that is not sold to a processor, directly to consumers without any additional testing or regulation. There is no raw milk license in Wisconsin. In the US there has never been a proven case of illness from raw-milk. If there were that case would be at the top of the list. That is why raw milk could not be mentioned at Vernon’s raw milk trial.
“how much REAL MILK is flowing locally, directly consequent from your own efforts” Are you with the FBI/CIA? How would I know that? My family of five drinks ten gallons a week. I have Vernon Hershberger’s picture on the side of my 1988 FORD pickup. Below the picture it reads Fresh Food is Not a Crime. Aren’t raw milk sales roughly the same in all states, around 3%, whether it’s legal or not?
Pro_life thing, and the DeTax two non-issues. Republicans support the troops and GE pays no taxes. http://youtu.be/LhzlQq1oBq0
But don’t come crying to me when Ruby Ridge / Waco and the end of Gordon Kahl, plays out in your neighbourhood no, I am not saying you have to do what I did / continue to do = contend with the idiots + communists in high places. which happens to be my calling I don’t get what your saying, are you an activist or FBI or are they the same thing?
different strokes for different folks yes, Marks methods may have worked somewhat in California but they certainly aren’t going to work in most states and are never going to work for farmers and the working class. Farmers will continue to be paid nothing for their milk and the 99% will not be able to afford raw milk for their children(for their coffee maybe).
Gordon, if in fact, we do have a disagreement, I would consider discussing it.
http://thecompletepatient.com/article/2010/february/1/when-it-comes-raw-milk-joseph-heckman-finds-academia-not-best-place-open
Debate Over Raw Milk Stirs Up Controversy in New Jersey and at Rutgers
http://news.rutgers.edu/issue.2011-11-29.5885625106/article.2011-12-14.9418220400#.UlFfevLD9D8
Mark McAfee Speaks to Soil Scientists and Agronomists.
http://hartkeisonline.com/2010/11/11/mark-mcafee-speaks-to-soil-scientists-and-agronomists
It is not easy coming out in academia in support of peoples right to eat the foods of their choice. I can also understand why some faculty may not be ready to do so in a public way. Getting fired and loss of grant funds are academic risks some may not be prepared to take.
A good web link on related subject matter by Professor Brian Martin:
http://www.uow.edu.au/~bmartin/pubs/supp.html
Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Martin_(professor)
1. The only way that’s going to change is by people, as individuals and in groups, directly standing up and changing it. In that way and in no other way. (I’m assuming you agree it does need to be changed.)
That’s includes academics. There are already plenty standing up and speaking out. For example Gilles-Eric Seralini, Judy Carman, Jack Heinemann, Arpaud Pusztai, Irina Ermakova – just to name a few who have spoken the truth about GMOs, often under great adversity. There’s you and others who speak out about raw milk. That’s just a few examples. Why would anyone who’s doing it be an apologist for those who won’t?
2. Where we’re talking about policy, the only thing that’ll bring real change is the people directly standing up and doing it for themselves. If we ever must rely on system “policy”, we must vigilantly oversee and police it every step of the way, from negotiations to enforcement.
But an absolute prerequisite for any change at all is that we get 100% beyond the pathology of ever trusting ANYONE – politician, businessman, NGO cadre, anyone – to go behind closed doors to “represent” us while we go back to sleep.
We’ve done that to death, and it’s failed every single time. No sincere activist can ever settle for this again, let alone offer to be the representative.
Do you not think that the powers that be, if they so desired, have the ability to determine what is being discussed and who is participating at those meetings? If so, wouldnt your unforthcoming approach apart from being a vain attempt to protect the reputation and livelihood of those involved, might also serve to undermine the integrity of raw milk movement?
Ken
At that meeting we expect to make serious progress and gain more respect than ever from all sorts of high and low places. The data from the testing of the RAWMI LISTED dairymen is something that is ground breaking and worthy of serious discussion and perhaps an FDA meeting very soon.
We want peace and we want progress. That does not mean appeasement. That means facts….cold hard facts. The market has spoken….fluid pasteurized milk is not doing well and raw milk is thriving. There is a reason and that reason is undeniable. Dollar voting is the most recognizable impact and it is clear….crystal clear. EU studies back us up.
I met with a small three cow raw milk operator near Sacramento yesterday that is doing a stellar job. They have invested dearly and the operations show all of the excellence that any consumer would want from their dairyman. I embrace this local effort and will do everything I can to support them as they work to become LISTED.
For all of you that wonder why I would ever do this when Nugget market and Sac Coop sell OPDC down the street, you do not know me and you fail to see the bigger picture.
As a raw milk producer…we are all teachers. If we all teach…there will never be enough high quality raw milk for the common demand. A rising tide floats all boats.
Lastly…I am sick and tired of feeling all alone in this very worthy fight. If we have more great raw milk producers that share the great responsibility to feed all of the hungry well informed consumers we have created and awakened, then we will begin to stand as an industry and community…and not as one crazy man that has some kind of passionate dream of healhty kids and strong immune sytems for all.
Think about what I have said…before you throw that very ripe organic tomato at me. You are now throwing it at a much larger group of producers that share this dream and live it and feed it and teach it every day.
Super high quality raw milk is not going away. It will be the expectation whether you are LISTED or not.
I do want to address the concern about Mark and RAWMI being anti small farm. Please look at the RAWMI website: http://www.rawmilkinstitute.net. Please look under the tab “Listed Farms” Three of the 4 farms listed there are 2-3 cow operations. OPDC is the only “real” dairy listed. There is actually a 5th listed farm in Canada that is not publicly listed on the website due to the hostile raw milk environment there, but that farm too is small.
Maybe not all small farms need the level of support that we were seeking to produce low risk raw milk. Maybe some farms are already very well informed on best production practices. But I will humbly admit that we have very much benefitted from such support. As new farmers, and the learning curve is steep.
We are now serving about 60 households. About 1/2 of them are Mark’s former customers. They come to our farm now instead of the grocery store. So how do you figure that? Still think RAWMI is against community food?
The end game here is to create a clear picture for consumers of what constitues responsible raw milk production. Every consumer who buys raw milk, whether from a 1 cow farm or a 500 cow dairy, should know the difference, and hopefully have the opportunity to choose to buy from a responsible producer. Right now, the majority of people assume that the government is defining and regulating food safety on their behalf. When they drop a milk carton into their grocery cart, the question about how that milk was produced, and whether or not there was a good plan to keep out harmful bacteria does not cross their mind.
If we want to have access to unregulated, farm direct raw milk, consumers and farmers must be responsible for themselves. They must understand what is required to produce milk that is both high-quality, and free from pathogens. Its not complicated, and safe raw milk production can be accomplished at every scale.
That is because in California, organic alfalfa hay costs more than $350 a ton. We feed our dairy cows extremely well, give them a full spectrum of minerals and supplements, have them regularly seen by a vet, hire responsible milking help when we need it, don’t use GMOs, don’t use soy, and buy local every chance we can. For us, our operating costs on the small scale, in terms of feed, vet care, and labor, are actually HIGHER than if we were to scale up.
Small and local does not equal cheaper….at least not in California!
Michele Jay-Russell
Clearly there’s a need for a Community Food organization teaching safe practices and publicizing them for the public. But the whole notion of negotiating the basis of this organization with the bureaucracy, working in tandem with it, toward the goal of legalizing real milk within the corporate framework rather than helping the Community Food sector break free of the industrial food sector, a completely separate sector which is alien to it, and doing all this while expressing suspicion of anyone who doesn’t get with this system “legalization” program, is highly questionable, and that’s what many of us are questioning.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/17/usa-alfalfa-gmo-idUSL2N0HD1SQ20130917
http://www.alternativesjournal.ca/policy-and-politics/be-warned
I have never been a big fan of alfalfa to begin with so my legume of choice, which is mixed with timothy and other wild grasses, is trefoil.
Most of the hay that I sell goes for horses and I sell it at $125 a ton. Some farmers sell their hay for a little less, others a little more.
My dairy and beef cattle are also fed very well. I do feed them a free choice mineral/salt supplement however the last time a vet came to the farm was at least 20 years ago, hell if I had a vet come in on a regular basis I would have to ask for a raise in order to increase my off farm income. I do not feed soy since it to is an extensively manipulated crop that cannot be guaranteed gmo free. I do not use vaccines, drugs (including antibiotics), pesticides, or herbicides.
Our building infrastructure costs up here in Northern Ontario are probably considerably more then in your neck of the woods.
I am inclined to agree that at $3 per gallon milk at the farm is under priced however I do know of farmers who sell their milk for less then $3 dollars per gallon.
How do they justify it you may ask? They have off farm Income.
Ken
Ken
I agree, and might add that even the definition of safe practice has been twisted by the central-thought crowd. It comes from industry–the medical industry.
Dave
Around here I buy small squares of horse-quality mixed grass hay for about $200 a ton. It often contains a bit of clover, trefoil, alfalfa, etc. None is certified organic. (Up-front hay cost goes down considerably with round bales or large squares, but when I figure in large-bale waste and handling costs (expensive machine vs. cheap manual labor) there is barely any money savings at all.) I know you will not be surprised to hear that our cows maintain health and condition exceedingly well on an herb-rich pasture (which lasts about 7 months) plus the aforementioned mixed-grass dry feed in the non-pasture months. I give no concentrates except for a selenium salt block which I presume is necessary since we have no selenium in our oil here (I would be happy to discover otherwise). This works of course because, as a family-cow owner, production volume is almost irrelevant. As such, even with increasing the number of cows for efficiency, I would need about $6/gallon minimum to make the operation financially sustainable. If it became necessary suddenly to compete in the cheap-food economy I would undoubtedly be pressed into considering confinement, Holsteins, and total mixed rations (which, for those of you unfamiliar, can be comprised of barely a third of forages (much of that fermented) and the remainder concentrates and ag by-products) and turning a blind eye to the externalized costs of pollution and disease.
Also, I was intrigued by your comment that some farmers near you sell their milk for under $3/gallon. Is that production milk? Co-op prices around here (almost always for milk from confined, high-producing, TMR-fed cows) are in the neighborhood of $1.50/gallon, so $3 would represent a price doubling. On the other hand, if that $3/gallon milk is any good, those farmers have evidently decided that their reward is not to be found in the money.
Thank you for your comment.
Permission granted to quote me.
Mr. J. Ingvar Odegaard
here is the URL to the announcement
http://www.thegrocer.co.uk/fmcg/fsa-to-kick-off-raw-milk-consultation-next-week/350124.article?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=rss
no doubt in my mind that we have won the point … “it’s all over but the crying” = meaning, when the dikto-crats find a way to save face – after coming-off as such fools in this controversy – raw milk will be de-facto legit., here in BC, thus, in all of Canada
Gordon S Watson
http://www.freewebs.com/bovinity
http://action.sumofus.org/s/world-food-prize-monsanto-syngenta-thanks/5/2/?action_id=11158628&akid=2390.289853.sUAiJ3&ar=1&form_name=act&rd=1&sub=fwd&t=1
Ken
These numbers come directly from a resent CDC report on a cucumbers, salmonella outbreak. It is a typical example of what the CDC passes off as a so call out break of foodborne illness.
1. Illness; diarrhea and not cancer, heart disease, osteoporosis, lactose intolerance etc. Aren’t these what the public would naturally assume the state is referring to when they say illness?
2. Food; only agricultural commodities and not canned food, cakes, cookies, candy, soda, chocolate milk etc. They are totally ignoring the really toxic foods that make up the majority of our diet. They actually have us afraid of spinach and sprouts, two of the healthiest foods on the planet.
3. Outbreak; 73 cases in 3 months, while the nearly 300 million other cases of diarrhea in this country are not even acknowledged. The average American gets diarrhea 3 times a year. There was no evidence to show that these 73 cases were actually caused by salmonella.
4. Association; cucumbers, because 67% of the 45 ill interviewed ate cucumbers while only 44% of the well people surveyed ate cucumbers and not because of any actual Salmonella contamination found.
5. Blame; 2 Mexican producers because 6 of the 45 ill interviewed eat their cucumbers and not because of any actual Salmonella contamination found.
I wish everyone could see just how absurd this is? These so called outbreaks are being used as an excuse to destroy our food supply, shorten our life span, and increase our dependents on expensive drugs that do not cure.
We are now serving about 60 households. About 1/2 of them are Mark’s former customers. They come to our farm now instead of the grocery store. Maybe I am misinformed. Is your farm in California?
But at this point, it is not. RAWMI is a private organization that assists in the voluntary self-regulation of raw milk processing and handling. Whether or not you participate with RAWMI has no bearing on the legality of your operation.
Lets keep it that way.
RawMilkMike, perhaps developing a good plan to keep pathogenic bacteria out of our milk, and off of my farm, is stipulating to the propaganda. But that is not what motivates me. Rather, when my friends and their children drink our milk, I want it to benefit their health, and never compromise it. Producing pathogen free milk is only one part of that. As we know, producing high quality, nutrient dense foods requires much more than just keeping out e coli and salmonella.
We are a herdshare. In California. Each one of our members is participatory. Each one attends an in-depth farm tour where we explain all of our growing and production practices. I have yet to have a share member say, Wow, I think your plan to wash your jars is a little unnecessary. Or, I really think its silly to clean your cows udders so well. Or, I think you should just feed our cows whatever is cheapest. Of course they don’t! Our members overwhelm us with gratitude for our attention to detail.
I predict that the number of farms that actually list with RAWMI will remain relatively small in proportion to the number of farms out there producing raw milk. However, MANY have and will benefit from the ongoing training and information on good procedures and innovations that RAWMI makes available. In the just last 3 weeks, I have spoken with 4 small herd producers in my area alone who have mined the RAWMI website, gleaned from RAMP plans of the listed farms. They are learning and growing confident in their ability to provide milk to their communities. Our community will soon have more opportunities to choose raw milk.
Russ, I agree with what you say here: Clearly there’s a need for a Community Food organization teaching safe practices and publicizing them for the public.
This is what I believe RAWMI is doing. And not RAMMI alone. There are other organizations such as the Oregon Raw Milk Producers, Raw Milk Colorado, Tim Wightman and his cowshare university, FTCLDF, that are also participating in this work.
From Organic Dairy Farms in Wisconsin: Prosperous, Modern, and Expansive
Table 1. Average Pay Price Per Cwt (2003)
$19.50
comes to $0.195×8.6# =$1.677 per gal.
Organic
Pay Price Needed to Continue
$ 16.80
comes to $0.168×8.6# = $1.4448 per gal.
These numbers come directly from a resent CDC report on a cucumbers, salmonella outbreak. It is a typical example of what the CDC passes off as a so call out break of foodborne illness.
1. Illness; diarrhea and not cancer, heart disease, osteoporosis, lactose intolerance etc. Aren’t these what the public would naturally assume the state is referring to when they say illness?
2. Food; only agricultural commodities and not canned food, cakes, cookies, candy, soda, chocolate milk etc. They are totally ignoring the really toxic foods that make up the majority of our diet. They actually have us afraid of spinach and sprouts, two of the healthiest foods on the planet.
3. Outbreak; 73 cases in 3 months, while the nearly 300 million other cases of diarrhea in this country are not even acknowledged. The average American gets diarrhea 3 times a year. There was no evidence to show that these 73 cases were actually caused by salmonella.
4. Association; cucumbers, because 67% of the 45 ill interviewed ate cucumbers while only 44% of the well people surveyed ate cucumbers and not because of any actual Salmonella contamination found.
5. Blame; 2 Mexican producers because 6 of the 45 ill interviewed eat their cucumbers and not because of any actual Salmonella contamination found.
I wish everyone could see just how absurd this is? These so called outbreaks are being used as an excuse to destroy our food supply, shorten our life span, and increase our dependents on expensive drugs that do not cure.
http://rawmilkinstitute.net/what-we-do/education-and-outreach/next_webinar/
Dr. Catharina Berge, DVM, will present the free webinar, the first in a series addressing The Bad Bugs in Milk. The focus of this presentation will be Salmonella.
All listed farmers are expected to attend as part of their continuing education, and all farmers currently in the listing process are encouraged to attend, along with any other interested person.
Right now organic feed prices are at all time highs due to weather and the stupid ethanol mandate. It would make more economic sense to sell the organic hay, corn etc for a profit and skip the milking process entirely.
As always you get what you pay for rawmilkmike. At $3.00 per gallon I think you are taking advantage of your farmer or he is taking advantage of you!! Is your farmer really doing everything he should to produce quality raw milk or is he/she cutting corners and just trying to get by. When were the rubber goods last changed?? Does he/she do any basic testing; bacteria, PI, or somatic cell count?? Is he/she keeping that cow that is off-feed out of the bulk tank??
I have noted before that you are price conscious, maybe you need to buy a cow and get your hands dirty so to speak. A year of being your own farmer and I think you would be happy to pay double what you pay now.
Wayne Craig
I love being able to buy direct from the farm and would miss it if I were forced to buy from Whole Foods. I would like to see the money I pay go to the farmer not to an inspector that doesn’t know the differences between raw milk and pasteurized and who is only looking for so called pathogens that I couldn’t care less about.
Outbreaks (said to be)from Foodborne Pathogens in Unpasteurized (Raw) Milk
1,786 fluid milk-related illnesses(diarrhea), no deaths:
(1998-2010)
The average American has 3 cases of diarrhea per yr. x 312.8 million people x 12 yrs. x 3% raw milk drinkers = 337.8 million cases of diarrhea raw milk drinker should have had just to be average. So, by their own numbers, is raw milk causing or preventing illness.
The link I was given took me to a good article on Vernon Hershberger and the Wisconsin raw milk bill. From there I went to the info I posted. I guess I inadvertently bypassed the negative stuff this time.
You know Marler Clark is a little like Mark McAfee they both agree raw milk can be dangerous.
I sold my quota a number of years ago so I am no longer a commercial milk producer. I have chosen rather to focus on the beef cattle (black angus). We continue to milk a couple of jersey cows for our own use. We make yogurt, soft cheese, butter, and ice cream from the excess milk and feed the skim milk to the livestock.
In Ontario dairy farmers are required by law to sell their milk to the milk board, otherwise known as the DFO (Dairy Farmers of Ontario). They are paid an average gross of 74 cents/liter or $2.96 /gallon before deductions. It is ill advised to ship beyond ones allotted quota.
Farmers with excess milk in order to avoid paying the over quota penalty have chosen to either dump it or sell it as a livestock feed.
After deductions, which include administration, research, DHI, transportation, market expansion, and CQM the average net price is 74 cents/liter or $2.81/gallon.
http://www.milk.org/corporate/pdf/Publications-AnnualReport.pdf
A typical jersey herd due to the higher total solids of the milk should gross about an extra 10 cents or more per liter. In other words 84 cents/liter or $3.19/gallon.
The above milk prices are not adequate. They havent been adequate for the last 20 years and that is why so many small farms have disappeared in this province.
In Chisholm Township where I live there used to be over thirty small commercial milk producers now there are none.
In the end we get what we pay for. If its cheap food that the consumer wants, cheap adulterated crap is what they will get.
http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2011/11/20/is_the_price_of_milk_too_high.html#
Ken
I get the picture.
From your link: “The way milk prices are determined in Canada is complicated. First, its not up to the free market. Prices are determined by the federal Canadian Dairy Commission and provincial marketing boards based on the cost of producing milk, consumers ability to pay and the Consumer Price Index. Farmers must have a quota essentially a license to produce milk. And they arent paid for the volume of their milk, but rather for the amount of butter fat, protein, lactose and other solids in it, and what it is used for.”
Very telling in that statement is the seemingly innocuous note that farmers are paid for what the fractions of their milk “are used for.” In other words, the needs of industry dictate the farm price, dictate who can buy the milk, and by default, dictate how it is produced (since you simply cannot produce good milk at the controlled price). You say, “If its cheap food that the consumer wants, cheap adulterated crap is what they will get.” Certainly yes, but I think most people have no idea that the food they eat is so damaging. They believe rather what they are told by industry (including, not least, the medical industry) and government.
Again, crap food is NOT cheap. But the actual costs are very effectively externalized–hidden in disease, pollution, debt, and most damaging of all, loss of community.
Dave
I hope regulators dont get it into their head to literally enforce such an idea. That comment is incorrect and should have stated rather, to sell milk to the milk board and only the milk board for human consumption, since there are literally thousands of location throughout the province where cows are being milked without a quota/license and there appears to be no issue with the practice as long as the milk does not leave the premises.
In Ontario it is illegal to sell or give away milk of the farm other then to the milk board.
Ken
the quota system arose from the New Economic Plan in Great Britain, back in the 1930s, when all the lib-tards of the day were glorifying communism as a step towards Utopia. All countries which tried centrally-dictated supply of milk, subsequently ditched it… except Canuck-istan. Lo a quarter of a century since the Berlin wall was breached, its practitioners persist in their fantasyworld, insulated from reality by political influence … better defined as “bribes” conveyed to political parties from the enormous corporate entities, via lawfirms.
the result of half a century of that essential policy of Stalin-ism, is, that producers lost control of the end-product. A book which spells-out the harms done by “homo milk” is ‘WHITEWASH’ by Joseph Keon. Setting aside his religious bias for vegan-ism, he makes the case that the stuff on retail shelves mis-branded “milk”, certainly is a significant threat to public health. The best part of his work, is – extensive references to scientific studies proving the white swill aka the endproduct of CAFOs IS the major cause of the diabetes epidemic in Ham-merica